Football (soccer) in all its glory WC, EPL, UCL etc..

[Gemerald]

Well after a composed campaign I'm hoping Arsenal can climb higher (obviously) and grab a piece of silver for the upcoming season.

With all the big moves being made at Real Madrid I'm hoping they flop. It be nice for someone to win titles without spending more money than the third world's GDP combined.

Anyone else feel the same?

[Shaddow]

Went to the Brisbane - Newcastle trial game at Ballymore, got well leathered, saw miron, called him a c***t, gave shit to some newcastle fans, called Lujbo a dickhead. oh and we lost.

[autologic]

I <3 Ljubo

and yeah I'd probably agree with you about Real, Gemerald. Will be interesting to see how they go anyway.

[grimace06]

Real is a greedy club and I don't understand the "prestige" it carries.

[Cian]

They're not greedy, they're just idiots.

[Lazlow]

So North Queensland has its own A-League team, the NQ Fury. But they based it in Townsville, which I found an odd move, as the stronger regional competition seems to be more up towards Cairns and the Tablelands.

It could be argued that Townsville has Dairy Farmers Stadium (NQ Cowboys ground) with its capacity of 27,000, but Cairns has Barlow Park with a max capacity of 18,000.

What's the average attendance for an metro A-League team?

[Pauly]

the funny thing with REAL is they haven't spent any money on their back line (that i know of), and none of the players they have bought will even bother defending. they might be able to score some goals but it remains to be seen what will happen when they don't have the ball. also i think it's a problem when you have too many big stars filling the same role. i'm not sure the team chemistry will be that great. i'd sooo love them to epically fail.

[Cian]

They did buy a defender.....can't remember his name. Aguero....possibly? But your point is still very true, Real are going to struggle defensively.

[Newton]

Albiol. Apparently he is handy.

Madrid had arguably the greatest strike partnership ever in Puskas and Di Stefano, who starred in what has been called the greatest football match of all time between Madrid and Eintracht Frankfurt. And they've won the European Cup more than any club in history.

They're a prestigious club, even though they've been acting like ****s in recent times.

[Gemerald]

I'd laugh if we get further than Madrid in CL this season despite Wenger being a tight-arse. Someone post a list of movers and shakers?

So North Queensland has its own A-League team, the NQ Fury. But they based it in Townsville, which I found an odd move, as the stronger regional competition seems to be more up towards Cairns and the Tablelands.

It could be argued that Townsville has Dairy Farmers Stadium (NQ Cowboys ground) with its capacity of 27,000, but Cairns has Barlow Park with a max capacity of 18,000.

What's the average attendance for an metro A-League team?

It can vary depending on weather, team etc but I'll let someone field it. You're not interested in getting a team?

EDIT: Beckham apparently got boo'd off at Galaxy and had to be restrained. Somewhat better start to my day.

[autologic]

I know the Jets usually attract between 10 and 15k. The biggest crowds they've had are a few of near-sellouts at Energy Australia Stadium, which has a capacity of 26k.

[Jabbz]

the funny thing with REAL is they haven't spent any money on their back line (that i know of), and none of the players they have bought will even bother defending. they might be able to score some goals but it remains to be seen what will happen when they don't have the ball. also i think it's a problem when you have too many big stars filling the same role. i'm not sure the team chemistry will be that great. i'd sooo love them to epically fail.

Yeah, its the real of a few years back. Buy as many superstars as you can and pray for success.

Man City I think has done the same thing this year, getting Tevez, Addeboyor and another striker I can't recall at this time, add Robinho and they have a potent force up front. But how do you play all those at once? It wont be like a Liverpool or Man U, they dont have that depth in other positions, so maybe, just maybe they will go all out... I hope so anyways.

United getting Owen was a shock, but for the price they paid (Free transfer) its a good deal. As for the other English clubs, I don't know who has gone where really.

All the talk of Inter making a trade for Ibramahimovich (spelling) seems to be just talk. EDIT: I now read that he has gone to Barca in a swap for Eto'o.

But keep an eye on City I think. They might not have a defence, but they might just have the attack to break the top 6. Top 4 won't change this season, though I think Liverpool, if Torres and Gerrardx stay fit and not in jail (I read somewhere on Gerrard being in court for assault, if anyone has news that would be good) might just pip Chelsea, with Man U third and Arsenal fourth. Just my predicitons.

Oh, and hear the talk of Tottenham and Chelsea bidding for Becks?

[autologic]

The charges against Gerrard were cleared.

[grimace06]

The charges against Gerrard were cleared.

No doubt if it was Vanilla player 37 he wouldve been done.

But of course Liverpool had to save poor Stevie - I wonder how much money they threw at the court?

[Cian]

Spurs bought a preying mantis.

[Shaddow]

What a ****ing rort, Liverpool 1 - Justice 0
Justice for Marcus McGee!
A bit like pleading insanity, he pleaded scouser, maybe thats how he got let off.

[Gemerald]

Well Toure and Adebayor are off to Man City (big spenders). I sorta have a soft spot for city. Good luck with Adebayor, watching him can be quite rewarding but frustrating at the same time.

[goog]

im very sad to see Kolo Toure leave, has been a great player for us and his partnership with Sol Campbell is the best central defensive pairing in my time watching arsenal. It would be good if we can hold on to Philippe Senderos though

[Blue]

No doubt if it was Vanilla player 37 he wouldve been done.

But of course Liverpool had to save poor Stevie - I wonder how much money they threw at the court?God, you really are a sad, biased ****.

They didn't pull an MJ and pay anybody off. The charges were cleared.

[grimace06]

God, you really are a sad, biased ****.

They didn't pull an MJ and pay anybody off. The charges were cleared.

Have you seen the video mate?

Stevie got lucky.

[Gemerald]

im very sad to see Kolo Toure leave, has been a great player for us and his partnership with Sol Campbell is the best central defensive pairing in my time watching arsenal. It would be good if we can hold on to Philippe Senderos though

I thought I was the only one who <3 Senderos. Bring him back from Milan.

[goog]

He is back from the loan but i saw an report linking him with everton :S. so i dont know. But for the money we got for Adebayor it seems like good business to let him go and we got good money for Toure too but defenders always go to cheap IMO. i hope Wenger has a couple of players that he is just waiting to swoop for

[Newton]

Looks like Senderos to Everton is a done deal.

I also think a lot of people are being too quick to write Arsenal off this season. Even if there aren't any new signings, they will still finish top four, and could be a dark horse.

The change in formation will make a huge difference. Arshavin has been on fire. Eduardo is looking excellent. Rosicky is back. Bendtner scored more goals than Adebayor last season and will only have gotten better. Van Persie is Van Persie. And players like Denilson and Song will have benefited massively from last season. It seems everyone is forgetting that Arsenal went on a more than twenty game unbeaten run in the league, starting with the win over Chelsea in November and (I'm pretty sure) ending against the same team in April/May.

Plus Ramsey looks a lot better and more mature, and Jack Wilshere (watch this space. Kid is a future super star) won consecutive man of the match awards at the Emirates Cup, inspired the kids to the FA Youth Cup last season, and generally looks to be an amazing talent.

With the rumours of Vieira coming back (potentially) and one or two promised new signings, the club is in a pretty good position.

With regards to the rest of the teams, here's how I see it:

Chelsea are aging and that could be a problem this season, although Ancelotti is no stranger to working with old, old players and doing well with them. Zhirkov is a fantastic addition. They'll be in the top two, if they don't win the league.

Liverpool, should they lose Alonso, will seriously struggle. If he does go I would suggest they will finish fourth. Otherwise they could challenge for the title. He really is that important to the team. His presences calms Mascherano and allows him to break things up, and allows Gerrard the freedom to nearly single handedly destroy teams. Last season showed how essential he is.

Man United are an interesting one. Owen could be a smash hit. I worry about their midfield a bit though (maybe I'm being silly?). The game against Barcelona exposed a lot of flaws there. IMO they don't have a replacement to Scholes (Carrick is pretty handy, but doesn't get enough goals and isn't as good as Scholes in his prime), and they miss a destroyer. Hargreaves hasn't been properly fit since he got there. I would still say they are favorites, although they're definitely not as strong as they have been in previous seasons.

Ranting has been fun. I might go to bed now.

Massive tl;dr I know.

[Blue]

Have you seen the video mate?

Stevie got lucky.Yes I have. Extenuating circumstances. Slap on the wrist, nothing more.

You've shown obvious bias in the past that is hard to dismiss. Gerrard has never been known to be a thug, on the field or off.

Newton, I think you may be overstating Xabi's importance just a touch. I certainly wouldn't consider selling him though. In my eyes, he's basically a lesser Gerrard that we can put in midfield, enabling Gerrard to play a more attackng role, as you said. I wouldn't consider him to be the difference between first and fourth, however. I believe that other players, such as Mascherano and more importantly Benayoun, can cover the gaps left by his absence. Even if Gerrard needs to drop back, Benayoun and Kuyt are potent attacking forces. Riera too, despite the fact that it took until the end of the season for me to even consider him half decent, is able to play a similar role. Alonso should stay, and I hope he does, but he is not a trophy-winner.

[grimace06]

Yes I have. Extenuating circumstances. Slap on the wrist, nothing more.

You've shown obvious bias in the past that is hard to dismiss. Gerrard has never been known to be a thug, on the field or off.


Mate, the only real response I've ever given to you in this thread has been in regards to your bias.

I think its a little fishy that Gerrard was the only one who pleaded not guilty when he instigated the incident by being - by all reports - an absolute cockhead.

If it was a player of a lesser stature he would've gotten more than a slap on the wrist.

If you want to defend him thats fine - I wouldn't have defended Cantona for what happened many years ago, Newcastle fans wouldn't defend Joey Barton

I've also never personally attacked you so please calm down.

Anyway, in other news Leeds youngster Fabian Delph has been signed by Villa and Chelsea have offered 8 million pounds for Pirlo - insanity.

[Jabbz]

[QUOTE=Newton;1099044]Man United are an interesting one. Owen could be a smash hit. I worry about their midfield a bit though (maybe I'm being silly?). The game against Barcelona exposed a lot of flaws there. IMO they don't have a replacement to Scholes (Carrick is pretty handy, but doesn't get enough goals and isn't as good as Scholes in his prime), and they miss a destroyer. Hargreaves hasn't been properly fit since he got there. I would still say they are favorites, although they're definitely not as strong as they have been in previous seasons.QUOTE]

We really missed Fletcher in that game, he has a good passing range, but not the scoring touch that Scholes has. But when you look at it, Scholes and Giggs will have their last seasons this year I think, which means we need to get more out of the younger guys. Nani and Anderson have to step up, I'm still unconvinced by them. And when Hargreaves gets fit, he will slot in nicely alongside Carrick.

I still miss Roy Keane!

[Gemerald]

Looks like Senderos to Everton is a done deal.
I'd be crushed if this goes through because I'm actually a fan of him.

I also think a lot of people are being too quick to write Arsenal off this season. Even if there aren't any new signings, they will still finish top four, and could be a dark horse.
Agreed but I think it's fair to say we're probably more vulnerable compared to previous seasons. I'm still not convinced on Rosicky.

The change in formation will make a huge difference. Arshavin has been on fire. Eduardo is looking excellent. Rosicky is back. Bendtner scored more goals than Adebayor last season and will only have gotten better. Van Persie is Van Persie. And players like Denilson and Song will have benefited massively from last season. It seems everyone is forgetting that Arsenal went on a more than twenty game unbeaten run in the league, starting with the win over Chelsea in November and (I'm pretty sure) ending against the same team in April/May.
I have question marks over Eduardo and Rosicky. I'm willing to give Bendtner support but he has to stop messing chances (obviously). Furthermore, I'm not very keen on Song. Denilson is hit and miss, sometimes good, sometimes bad.

Plus Ramsey looks a lot better and more mature, and Jack Wilshere (watch this space. Kid is a future super star) won consecutive man of the match awards at the Emirates Cup, inspired the kids to the FA Youth Cup last season, and generally looks to be an amazing talent.
I'm glad you didn't mention Gibbs.

With the rumours of Vieira coming back (potentially) and one or two promised new signings, the club is in a pretty good position.
Wouldn't put any weight behind the rumour.

With regards to the rest of the teams, here's how I see it:

Chelsea are aging and that could be a problem this season, although Ancelotti is no stranger to working with old, old players and doing well with them. Zhirkov is a fantastic addition. They'll be in the top two, if they don't win the league.

Liverpool, should they lose Alonso, will seriously struggle. If he does go I would suggest they will finish fourth. Otherwise they could challenge for the title. He really is that important to the team. His presences calms Mascherano and allows him to break things up, and allows Gerrard the freedom to nearly single handedly destroy teams. Last season showed how essential he is.

Man United are an interesting one. Owen could be a smash hit. I worry about their midfield a bit though (maybe I'm being silly?). The game against Barcelona exposed a lot of flaws there. IMO they don't have a replacement to Scholes (Carrick is pretty handy, but doesn't get enough goals and isn't as good as Scholes in his prime), and they miss a destroyer. Hargreaves hasn't been properly fit since he got there. I would still say they are favorites, although they're definitely not as strong as they have been in previous seasons.

Ranting has been fun. I might go to bed now.

Massive tl;dr I know.

Probably best to summarise it like this. It's going to be interesting to see how the new buys fit into the already established clubs and how the transfer market has played out. There will obviously be a lot of shuffling mid season to fix any "teething issues". Having said that, I think we can agree Arsenal is less prone to these since we spend 20 pence on players.

[Cian]

Senderos to Everton is a blow simply because Gallas is starting to become injury prone.

Vieira will be a great if he comes back. Cheap, experienced and still good.

We could still do with another central defensive player though...but I can't think of who.

I don't think Manchester City will break the top four...they'll be too unbalanced and they still haven't got a squad strong enough to challenge.

But what's really interesting me is La Liga, is anyone else excited to see Ronaldo fail miserably? I can't wait to see his ego smashed and his persona destroyed until he becomes a shadow that people will forget about. Ahh yes, 'twill be a great spectacle.

[Blue]

Mate, the only real response I've ever given to you in this thread has been in regards to your bias.

I think its a little fishy that Gerrard was the only one who pleaded not guilty when he instigated the incident by being - by all reports - an absolute cockhead.

If it was a player of a lesser stature he would've gotten more than a slap on the wrist.

If you want to defend him thats fine - I wouldn't have defended Cantona for what happened many years ago, Newcastle fans wouldn't defend Joey Barton

I've also never personally attacked you so please calm down.

Anyway, in other news Leeds youngster Fabian Delph has been signed by Villa and Chelsea have offered 8 million pounds for Pirlo - insanity.Calm down? I've hardly said a word.

I'm not just talking about what you've said to me, or against Liverpool, I'm talking about your general attitude towards anyone who isn't from your club. It grates. Why would Cantona need defending, anyway?

[grimace06]

Calm down? I've hardly said a word.

Why would Cantona need defending, anyway?

u-WmfTIRUWY

[grimace06]

But what's really interesting me is La Liga, is anyone else excited to see Ronaldo fail miserably? I can't wait to see his ego smashed and his persona destroyed until he becomes a shadow that people will forget about. Ahh yes, 'twill be a great spectacle.

The other Ronaldo "failed" at Real Madrid, so did Beckham, so did Owen, so did Zidane to some extent.

Nobody will ever forget those guys. ;)

I expect Cristiano to start brightly and then get injured or something similar.

But to be honest, I'm more interested in seeing Ibrahimovic at Barca and how he adapts to the Spanish game.

[Cian]

The other Ronaldo "failed" at Real Madrid, so did Beckham, so did Owen, so did Zidane to some extent.

Nobody will ever forget those guys. ;)

I expect Cristiano to start brightly and then get injured or something similar.

But to be honest, I'm more interested in seeing Ibrahimovic at Barca and how he adapts to the Spanish game.

The four players you mentioned weren't forgotten because they had more than one good season in their career ;)

Madrid have insured his legs for £90m apparently...that story is swimming around somewhere.

Yeah the Ibrahimovic situation is interesting, especially considering how overpriced he was. Eto'o along with £40m? Nonsense.

[grimace06]

The four players you mentioned weren't forgotten because they had more than one good season in their career ;)

Madrid have insured his legs for £90m apparently...that story is swimming around somewhere.

Yeah the Ibrahimovic situation is interesting, especially considering how overpriced he was. Eto'o along with £40m? Nonsense.

I would argue that Cristiano has had about three "good" seasons and one "great" one but thats neither here nor there.

[Cian]

I would argue that Cristiano has had about three "good" seasons and one "great" one but thats neither here nor there.

He had a poor season last year. He somehow managed to score 40 goals the year before that. Prior to the 2008 season I rated him as average-borderling-good.

But I remember when he signed for you guys in...whatever year it was. He was definitely one of the worst players in the Man Utd squad, and one of the worst players in the top four teams. All showboating with no end product for years until finally something clicked in 2008. Then his ego took over. Good riddance to him.

[proofreeder]

So much Ronaldo hatred.

I understand he is egotistical and a very selfish player.

But his technique is better than anyone elses in the game today. He is an incredible player, possibly only surpassed by Zidane in my time of watching football at least, and that's because Zidane was a team player.

Look at his body shape when he runs and performs step-overs at full speed. It's exquistite.

People believe excessive stepovers is showboating.

Well, I'm a massive fan of stepovers. Maybe Ronaldo takes it too far sometimes, that could be true.

But when I play soccer, I use stepovers extensively. Essentially they're just fakes. If you can perform a stepover without the risk of losing possession, then you can freeze the defender, or hopefully get him to overcommit, without any risk. Football, like many things, is a balance of risk and reward. Stepovers are a means of sometimes obtaining an opportunity for reward with minimal risk.

Ibrahimovic (sp? w/e) is a great player also, although he's very streaky IMO, sometimes he doesn't get the ball. Overpaid no doubt, but that's the way it is nowadays, the absolute cream get all the money.

I dunno why Man C need so many strikers. Have they bought a decent playmaker yet? I dunno about Man C's strategy plan, although I haven't researched it much. Paying top dollar for in demand talent doesn't seem like the way to do it to me. Buying undervalued talent would be much more preferable IMO.

Nani and Anderson, to whoever said that... Man U are in trouble. Chelsea, possibly Liverpool for mine.

I don't mind that Wilkshire guy from Arsenal either, he seemed decent from the one cameo I've seen him play.

[Pauly]

ronaldo is good but nowhere near what he was bought for. i'm glad manu got rid of him tbh. just hoping they pick someone else up.

[Newton]

But to be honest, I'm more interested in seeing Ibrahimovic at Barca and how he adapts to the Spanish game.I'm more interested in seeing how he adapts to Barca's game.

Their success last season was based on getting the ball and keeping it. The forwards for Barca were easily the most important players in them winning the ball back, highlighted by a stat which showed Messi, Henry and Eto'o committed more fouls than anyone else in the team. They were pressing so hard, so high up the park. It made their fairly average defense look a lot better than it actually is.

That kind of work ethic and team play doesn't work unless everyone is pulling their weight in a big way, and while Ibra is capable of brilliance, and can do things that no-one else in the game can do, he's also capable of laziness. I can't see him working as hard as Eto'o, and that could prove disruptive to Barca's team ethic.

Guardiola has proven to be an excellent manager, and this could prove to be shrewd, or a rookie manager making his first real mistake. I'm fascinated to see how it goes.

On a side note, the Classico matches this season will be unbelievably good. Jizz in my pants good.

Also, Alonso left for Madrid. Liverpool might be in pretty big trouble. Although they are targeting Aquilani, who is excellent. That's shit, because I was hoping Arsenal would sign him.

[proofreeder]

'Allo football fans. Nothing to add aside from saying check out my picture in my avatar! That's a football injury folks. That's what we do for the love of the game. It's almost healed now (thank God) and I'm just ****ing itching to get out there and perform incessant zany Ronaldo stepovers!!! Football was my life before the injury and I've missed it sooo much.

[Ad-Rock]

Soccer training should be good tonight - we have a coach from the German Bundesliga training us tonight. Holga Schule is his name form SV Elvesberg.

I think its only a 4th division team or something, but still pretty cool :D

[Jay]

Chelsea pinched an injury time winner against Hull. 2 for Drogba. Awesome. :)

[Cian]

Chelsea pinched an injury time winner against Hull. 2 for Drogba. Awesome. :)

What a ****

[grimace06]

Typical 93rd minute snatch from Chelsea.

[Blue]

Typical 93rd minute snatch from Chelsea.Typical crying from you.

There were 96 minutes in the match. They're allowed to use all of them, you know. They don't have to stop playing at the 85 minute mark. They had 65% possession in the second half, and you think they didn't deserve the win? You always say the same thing when Liverpool, Chelsea, or any other team score a late goal to win, labeling it "arsey bullshit" or the like. That's football, that's why it's exciting, because the outcome isn't always obvious at the 80 minute mark. Yet you seem to hate late goals, and feel that if a team hasn't taken the lead by half time, then they should just play kick-to-kick for the rest of the game.

:rolleyes:

[Gemerald]

Glad I stayed up to watch it, it's only 60 minutes in and the toffees are already pouring out :/

EDIT: Pretty silly to leave so soon, their missing out on world class football here :D

[Newton]

Yeah I'll take 6-1 and the British press doing the fastest 180 EVER. Idiots.

[Blue]

It is only Everton.



:p

[Newton]

Apparently the biggest opening day victory in Premier League history.

Nice touch by Fabregas holding up a shirt with Dani Jarque's name after his second goal.

[Jay]

There were 96 minutes in the match. They're allowed to use all of them, you know. They don't have to stop playing at the 85 minute mark. They had 65% possession in the second half, and you think they didn't deserve the win? You always say the same thing when Liverpool, Chelsea, or any other team score a late goal to win, labeling it "arsey bullshit" or the like. That's football, that's why it's exciting, because the outcome isn't always obvious at the 80 minute mark. Yet you seem to hate late goals, and feel that if a team hasn't taken the lead by half time, then they should just play kick-to-kick for the rest of the game.



As a passionate supporter I can see where grimace's frustration comes from but you are absolutely right, and one of the things that separates the top few clubs from the rest is their ability to play out time.

How good is it to have the Premier League back though? :)

[Cian]

Wow...wow.

Arsenal's performance rivalled their best of last season, and we were missing Nasri. We were incredibly well balanced unlike last season, Vermaelen looked very solid at the back and got a nice headed goal. It was nice to see Fabregas get a couple, but he needs to keep up that type of goalscoring otherwise he'll be wearing a Barcelona shirt next year. The only negative was the late goal that Everton grabbed, it was inevitable but it would have been nice to keep a clean sheet.

The most exciting/important players for us this season will be Arshavin and Bendtner (I can't believe I just said that). They have an unrivalled amount of commitment. Bendtner suprised the shit out of me, running at goal with good feet and impressive displays of control. He was willing to shoot OUTSIDE of the box, and that's something we need to see more of this season.

Let the form continue.

[Blue]

As a passionate supporter I can see where grimace's frustration comes from but you are absolutely right, and one of the things that separates the top few clubs from the rest is their ability to play out time.

How good is it to have the Premier League back though? :)It's brilliant. I'm so happy.

I saw a question being asked on Footy Classified the other day, regarding whether the AFL season was too long. 22 rounds, plus finals? Pfft. Try 40 matches! I love how short the EPL off-season is.

[Newton]

The most exciting/important players for us this season will be Arshavin and Bendtner (I can't believe I just said that). They have an unrivalled amount of commitment. Bendtner suprised the shit out of me, running at goal with good feet and impressive displays of control. He was willing to shoot OUTSIDE of the box, and that's something we need to see more of this season.

Let the form continue.Hate to say I told you so. Actually no, I'm happy for the great Dane (now officially B52) and thought he had an excellent game. Song was immense. Fabregas was Fabregas. RvP got two assists. Great game.

[Shaddow]

Faubert looks like he'll be a decent right back this season, provided us with width and pace against Wolves, we'll be good as long as Matty Upson stays.

[goog]

People where to quick to hate Bentner and Everton is a top 6 side so to smash them 6-1 is great. I also liked seeing Edwardo back too

[Gemerald]

Hate to say I told you so. Actually no, I'm happy for the great Dane (now officially B52) and thought he had an excellent game. Song was immense. Fabregas was Fabregas. RvP got two assists. Great game.

If anything I should be the one who is saying it. I stuck by the Dane. I think he has a lot more to offer us. I'm still going to be happy with a top 4 season but am really pleased with the result. Disappointed we let one in.

Again, I'm not keen on having the faulty manuel behind us, but we could be doing worse.

[Cian]

This is hilarious; http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/sport/football/article-1206823/Luis-Figo-Patrick-Vieira-Notts-County-hitlist-Sven-Goran-Eriksson-targets-stunning-signings.html

[goog]

preping for April fools me thinks. that has to be a joke

[proofreeder]

You mean next April fools? That's some prepping.

[Blue]

Have they actually signed Kasper Schmeichel, though?

[Newton]

If anything I should be the one who is saying it. I stuck by the Dane. I think he has a lot more to offer us. I'm still going to be happy with a top 4 season but am really pleased with the result. Disappointed we let one in.Pretty sure we can both say it. I've been banging that drum for quite a while.

Also, HOW GOOD WAS SONG?!!? SERIOUSLY! MotM behind Cesc, but not by much. And that's saying something considering Cesc got two goals and two assists. Pretty much the main reason why Everton's midfield was non-existent.

EDIT: And have fun winning the league Liverpool. Loved the "You're supposed to be in jail" chants directed at that guy who should be in jail.

[Blue]

Who should be in jail?

Tottenham looked good, actually. They've picked up some good players since last season. Their performance was spoilt by some cynical defending in the last twenty minutes; namely, the shoves on Voronin and Torres. It should have been two converted penalties for Steve. I missed the first ten minutes, so I didn't see how both Skrtel and Carragher had their heads cracked open, but that certainly didn't help. They were both pretty sluggish for the rest of the match. I wouldn't write Liverpool off based on that game.

Also, Babel really hasn't lived up to the potential he displayed a couple of years ago, has he? Benayoun should have played from the start. I couldn't believe it when I saw Andriy Voronin take to the field either. I thought he was finished.

[Newton]

Stevie G. I say it more because it makes Liverpool fans angry than any strong belief that he should be in jail. I don't care one way or the other really.

The head clash was strange. Carragher had a look up and can't have missed Skrtel running at the ball. Why he chose to go in anyway is beyond me.

Babel chose the wrong club. He was linked with Arsenal for months and months, and is a good friend of Van Persie's. Benitez is tactically sound, but Arsene Wenger undoubtedly would have been better able to convert his raw potential into something special. As it stands his career is stalling and I see him leaving Liverpool in the next year or so (and I'd still take him at Arsenal to be honest. There's something there.)

[Blue]

Stevie G. I say it more because it makes Liverpool fans angry than any strong belief that he should be in jail. I don't care one way or the other really.

The head clash was strange. Carragher had a look up and can't have missed Skrtel running at the ball. Why he chose to go in anyway is beyond me.

Babel chose the wrong club. He was linked with Arsenal for months and months, and is a good friend of Van Persie's. Benitez is tactically sound, but Arsene Wenger undoubtedly would have been better able to convert his raw potential into something special. As it stands his career is stalling and I see him leaving Liverpool in the next year or so (and I'd still take him at Arsenal to be honest. There's something there.)I just thought he'd always be a natural fit to replace Kewell on the left wing, but it hasn't really worked out like that. He's definitely a good player, and perhaps he would fit in better elsewhere. I could see him at Arsenal.

Johnson was promising.

[goog]

the better team won, liverpool where dissapointing all over the park and i dont know where people get the idea of a second penalty from, robbie keane could have had a first half hat trick. I think glen johnson was liverpools best

[Blue]

the better team won, liverpool where dissapointing all over the park and i dont know where people get the idea of a second penalty from, robbie keane could have had a first half hat trick. I think glen johnson was liverpools bestVoronin was shoved off the ball, blatantly. Where you watching the game? Robbie Keane could have, if he'd got it past Schwarzer, but he didn't. He should have scored, but he obviously doesn't know how to finish.

Drogba for the golden boot. My tip.

[Gilder]

robbie keane could have had a first half hat trick.

No he couldn't, he is Robbie Keane.

[goog]

I watched a replay that i recorded useing MyStar. I thought that he went down far to easy. Oh and Gilder u dont happen to be a Liverpool supporter because would be the only reason someone would dislike Robbie Keane. My tip for golden boot is Emmanuel Adebayor he looked very good for Man City

[Blue]

I watched a replay that i recorded useing MyStar. I thought that he went down far to easy. Oh and Gilder u dont happen to be a Liverpool supporter because would be the only reason someone would dislike Robbie Keane. My tip for golden boot is Emmanuel Adebayor he looked very good for Man CityVoronin went down easy? Voronin. Andriy Voronin. The guy who just got shoved off the ball. The guy with the ponytail. Voronin.

In other words, no, you're an idiot.

Also, people might not like Keane because he doesn't score any ****ing goals.

So stop talking shit.

[grimace06]

Voronin went down easy? Voronin. Andriy Voronin. The guy who just got shoved off the ball. The guy with the ponytail. Voronin.

In other words, no, you're an idiot.

Also, people might not like Keane because he doesn't score any ****ing goals.

So stop talking shit.

You give me crap for allegedly acting biased and you post shit like this?

You're clearly one of those people who started following football - oh, I dunno, around May 2005?

Stop acting like an idiot and let people have their opinions without being subjected to you raving on like a moron.

FTR, I think Voronin deserved a penalty but its a bit rich for you to complain after you attack me for voicing my frustrations.

[Gilder]

Oh and Gilder u dont happen to be a Liverpool supporter because would be the only reason someone would dislike Robbie Keane.

Nah Newcastle (*sob*), but Robbie Keane has to be one of the biggest chokers in the sport.

[goog]

I was thinking of the other time he just fell over when steven carr stood on his foot. It was the same player. I still dont think it was a penalty, either way i dont know why u would start some kind of personal attack on me.


Edit Robbie Keanes record stands for it self. 85 goals in 212 games for tottenham and his record for liverpool of 5 goals in 19 games isnt that bad either. He is also the Republic of Irelands all time top scorer

[grimace06]

I was thinking of the other time he just fell over when steven carr stood on his foot. It was the same player. I still dont think it was a penalty, either way i dont know why u would start some kind of personal attack on me.
P.S Robbie Keanes record stands for it 85 goals in 212 games for tottenham and his record for liverpool of 5 goals in 19 games isnt that bad either. He is also the Republic of Irelands all time top scorer

What do Robbie Keane, Peter Crouch, Craig Bellamy, Sinama Pongolle, Fernando Morientes, Djibril Cisse and Ryan Babel have in common?

All were/are capable of scoring goals for Liverpool but were victims of mis-management, a lack of versatile tactics and of course the arrival of a very talented and pasty spaniard (for a couple of them). :p

But of course alot of Liverpool fans ignore all this and just sit there and criticise them constantly despite when those who leave perform rather well for other clubs.

It's happened with Man U too - Louis Saha and soon Dimitar Berbatov ($30 Million? I still cant get over that).

[Blue]

You give me crap for allegedly acting biased and you post shit like this?

You're clearly one of those people who started following football - oh, I dunno, around May 2005?

Stop acting like an idiot and let people have their opinions without being subjected to you raving on like a moron.

FTR, I think Voronin deserved a penalty but its a bit rich for you to complain after you attack me for voicing my frustrations.May 2005? Is that meant to have some signifigance, or is it a random date? Clearly, you've no idea about my life, so making baseless assumptions is pointless.

Anyway, no, I'm not going to cop that. It was a penalty. No matter the team, no matter the league, under the rules of football, that was a penalty. He doesn't 'think' it was a penalty? Then he's being stupid.

Now you're accusing me of begrudging players leaving the club? **** right off. I'm glad Crouch left, because he didn't fit in at Liverpool, and he's doing better now. I just had a conversation only a few posts ago where I said I wouldn't mind if Babel went to Arsenal, for ****'s sake.

Keane can't finish consistently.

The majority of your arguments boil down to calling Gerrard a rapist, before generalising Liverpool fans as this or that. Apply this formula to any club, and you have your take on it.

[goog]

Anyway, no, I'm not going to cop that. It was a penalty. No matter the team, no matter the league, under the rules of football, that was a penalty. He doesn't 'think' it was a penalty? Then he's being stupid.
.
Rules are open to interpretation.Phill Dowd also didnt think it was a penalty i assume u think he is stupid as well? Harry Redknap aslo didnt think it was a penalty "I did not think Liverpool's shout for a second penalty was right as Assou-Ekotto has just eased Voronin off the ball" i assume he is also an idiot.

also Man U loseing to burnley is just amazing

[grimace06]

also Man U loseing to burnley is just amazing

The half-arsed away efforts circa-2004 are back for Man U I see :(

[grimace06]

So Villa beat Liverpool 3-1 at Anfield.

Lucas scores a cracker own goal while Stevie G gives away a penalty.

Gold.

[Grechy]

Losing Xabi in the off-season was always going to be difficult to cope with. We're in a bit of strife now. I can't see us winning the league from here. We lost 2 games last season and we've already lost 2 now 3 games in. Pretty disapointed but with no money to splurge in the kitty and too many so-so players I don't expect less.

Also **** LUCAS!!!

[Cian]

Could Liverpool be the ones to drop out of the top four...?

[Shadow Knight]

Got my tickets to Socceroos V Netherlands in October. Can. Not. Wait. :D

[grimace06]

Could Liverpool be the ones to drop out of the top four...?

While I would love to see this, we're only 3 games in.

Christmas time is when we know.

[Newton]

So far, my prediction of Liverpool struggling massively, and Alonso being the difference between the title and fourth place, looks to be on the money. Although grimace is right, it's only three games, I was always of the opinion that last season for Liverpool was a fluke. They were only runners up once in the Premier League before last season.

As an Arsenal fan I was pretty annoyed. I'm not going to lie. Arsenal have been much more consistent than Liverpool since the PL's inception, and then Liverpool have one good season and they're title contenders and it's a big three instead of a big four. No matter what happens, a team that finished in the top two for nearly half of the Premier League since the beginning, and has been top four since Wenger arrived, deserved better than that. Yeah I'm bitter. Pundits make me angry.

Ranting is great. If only people respected my opinion.

[grimace06]

So far, my prediction of Liverpool struggling massively, and Alonso being the difference between the title and fourth place, looks to be on the money. Although grimace is right, it's only three games, I was always of the opinion that last season for Liverpool was a fluke. They were only runners up once in the Premier League before last season.

As an Arsenal fan I was pretty annoyed. I'm not going to lie. Arsenal have been much more consistent than Liverpool since the PL's inception, and then Liverpool have one good season and they're title contenders and it's a big three instead of a big four. No matter what happens, a team that finished in the top two for nearly half of the Premier League since the beginning, and has been top four since Wenger arrived, deserved better than that. Yeah I'm bitter. Pundits make me angry.

Ranting is great. If only people respected my opinion.

I respect your opinion - except when it comes to Fabregas :P

[Jabbz]

It would be great to see Liverpool drop down to 5th.... but I think I'd rather they stay 4th if Man City were to get into the top four.... Arsenal have been consistant, much more so than Liverpool...

[Newton]

That was quite a dive by Eduardo. It wouldn't have made a difference, but it was pretty disappointing. Arshavin's and Eboue's goals were pretty great though. And Vermaelen has been massively impressive so far. Really, really impressive.

[Cian]

That was quite a dive by Eduardo. It wouldn't have made a difference, but it was pretty disappointing. Arshavin's and Eboue's goals were pretty great though. And Vermaelen has been massively impressive so far. Really, really impressive.

Gemerald refused to believe me when I said how good Vermaelen has been. Great buy imo

[Newton]

Gemerald is crazy. Vermaelen has been immense. As has Song.

[Newton]

Chris Coyne+Andy Todd = Keeping the score at 2-1.

Cheers Glory. It was absolutely freezing at Members Equity.

[Cian]

Ok...before I rant; watched the Liverpool and Bolton game last night. Really good match, plenty of goals and a red card. Liverpool clearly deserved the win, no question about that. Although they're still struggling without Alonso.


That was a good start to the football, however the following game was something different entirely. Manchester United did not deserve to win. The foul on Arshavin before he scored the goal set the tone for that idiot referee Riley. The challenge was late and took out Arshavin, it couldn't have been clearer yet it's waved away. There was sweet revenge though with Arshavin's fantastic strike. From there until the Man Utd's penalty we dominated. We're much improved upon last season, we look incredibly balanced and we're now making other teams fearful (even Ferguson changed his usual formation).

The penalty....the ****ing penalty. Rooney took a terrible touch, he was never going to catch up to that ball. If you look at the replay, Rooney's left leg has already gone to ground before Almunia has touched him. It's difficult for the referee to tell without video evidence to use but it's arguably a dive. So we've established; Rooney's mistake, he's going nowhere, and he's already decided to hit the floor. So now we're drawing. The second goal a few minutes later was bizarre and very unlucky. I felt sorry for Diaby because I've always thought highly of him. These goals came soon after Ben Foster saved Van Persie's shot with his little toe, a huge moment in the game.

Even after Man Utd took the lead, they really didn't improve that much. Apart from Nani having a chance and Berbatov's terrible shot in stoppage time, we still played better. Throughout the game we had to deal with bullshit refereeing which I felt was a direct result of the Eduardo situation (his dive and subsequent manhunt by UEFA). The last goal we got was offside, I'm not arguing that one although if the goal was allowed it would have been a much fairer score.

So what else can I say? Typical Old Trafford referee bias followed by two lucky goals for United in a match which was dominated by Arsenal. I'm angry, all Arsenal fans should be angry. But at the same time, I'm not worried because if Man Utd don't start playing better and improve, particularly with their passing, then they won't win any respectable silverware. It was a good performance from us and we're a much greater threat than last year, and Arshavin is going to be a key player for us. Once we get Nasri back and drop Eboué (clueless in the final third), we'll definitely be a strong force. I remain confident and believe that justice will be served, hopefully in our next match we'll show some real passion and recover from this loss. I don't often single out rival teams (aside from Spurs) but believe me, I'll be cheering on every team Manchester United play against for the rest of the season.

Thank you and get ****ed.

[Newton]

Couldn't agree more. Man United were shocking for the most part. Rooney's going down in the box (we've seen the replays by now) will not get any coverage, because he is English. Darren Fletcher not getting any kind of booking is absolutely unbelievable.

I was disgusted by the result, because United were so average and were there for the taking. On the evidence of their early season form, they might struggle. They didn't deserve to win that game. Ben Foster's miracle save early in the second half and Van Persie hitting the bar both stand out.

I was disappointed in Diaby for the own goal. He was under no pressure. I was disappointed in Almunia for being so hasty. He had no need to come off his line. There was no chance of Rooney getting near that ball. Although he was already on the way down before he was within a metre of Almunia.

Shit! SHIT!

[grimace06]

Probably should've been a draw.

Man U had the better of the first half up until the goal.

Rooney played Almunia like a fool.

LOL Diaby.

Evra was close to best on the pitch - both in defense and his attacking runs.

Arsenal players went to ground way too easily.

Carrick should never play for us again.

Giggs is still a champ who got us back in the game.

So, a bullet dodged.

See you at Emirates.

[proofreeder]

Cheer up Man U haters. They'll slip this season.

Chelsea will probably win.

Man City will hit top four, this year or the next, ousting Liverpool or Arsenal. I love Liverpool, but hope Arsenal don't get knocked out of CL. They seem like the good minnow fighting against the big coorperations who bulldoze their way through with money. Plus, there's a lot of gunners fans on this forum, so never hurts to say something nice about them. Ha ha.

Mind you, my opinions are tainted by not watching many EPL games lol.
I have no idea how well Arsenal are playing now, aside from Arsharvin's a superstar player, so that should help.

Cisse was great at certain things, but was far too one dimensional. I love Babel, but Benayoun's better. Benayoun on the left, Babel on the right for mine. Did Babel get traded? I love Crouch too, his only caveat was his lack of mobility. Which, when you're 6'7" or whatever he is, is understandable.

[grimace06]

Arsenal getting done by Man City and Adebayor running all the way up the other end to the Arsenal fans was gold - they are looking good and will be tough next week.

Liverpool win in a canter as expected.

Chelsea....are Chelsea and lets leave it at that.

Man U - our best performance of the year, Berbatov moved well, Rooney killed them, Evra was once again all class and all of our goals were well made.

Don't think Scholes deserved a second yellow, though - it was a 50-50 ball.

[pezhead015]

Ok...before I rant; watched the Liverpool and Bolton game last night. Really good match, plenty of goals and a red card. Liverpool clearly deserved the win, no question about that. Although they're still struggling without Alonso.


They only won because we were down to ten men. That red card was a joke.

[Cian]

I'm angry again.

There's something fundamentally wrong at Arsenal, there has been for years. I'm not sure what it is, but there seems to be an awful lack of desire and little or no heart (especially when something goes against the run of play). I'll elaborate.

Fabregas is not a captain. He's too young and he has his eyes set to Barcelona next season. I'll be shocked if this isn't his last year for Arsenal. He's a gifted player, hugely creative and a key player for us....but he's not captain material. Last night is a good example of where we need a Vieira type figure. We were all over Manchester City after Robin's goal, then out of nowhere we get hit on the counter (first of three) and Bellamy scores. That's where Fabregas needs to rally everyone and keep the heads up. He's just not able to do it. Even worse than this, Wenger has no replacement for him when he leaves. Even though I'm completely against the pussy acting of Gallas last season, he was still a better captain.

That's Fabregas out of the way. As for the rest of the team...well, it's our midfield that isn't working. At all. Denilson and Song simply aren't good enough for Arsenal. They have no balls. We were shoved off the ball throughout the match and both of those players had no impact whatsoever. And don't start me on Eboué. People say he's versatile, yeah...he's ****ing useless no matter where he plays. They're not fighting for the club like the good ol' days when Vieira was around. Our back four should be ok, if we had two solid holding players in front of them. But Wenger won't pull his finger out of his arse and buy the type of player we need.

At the other end of the pitch, I have a lot of respect for Van Persie. He always tries his best, constantly pushing and you could see how much the goal meant to him. The problem is that he can't play effectively without a good supporting striker. And let's face it, we haven't had a good striking partnership for a long time. Eduardo had yet to come back and play to his full potential. Vela is rubbish. Bendtner....well, he's a tricky one. I appreciate the effort he puts in, but sometimes I wonder if he's thinking properly. If anyone can play with Robin then it's probably him.

That's a whole lot of negative, but there was one positive. Rosicky. It was great to see him back at the top level and within ten minutes he showed more creativity than Denilson has in the past year. He assisted the goal with a good pass and showed some clever touches, the guy still has it. I hope for our sake he stays fit so that we can demote Denilson to the bench. That's the only bright light from the match.

As for Manchester City...well, if they keep this up we won't be playing in the Champions League next season, simple as that. They completely outplayed us, physically and technically. Bellamy and Adebayor worked well up front (Ade's run into the box in the second half...woah). Their defence and midfield combined well, something that we need to start doing more of. Although, the most impressive part of their team is the spirit. They're all fully committed and fearless, they're solid defensively and counter attack effectively....wait, isn't that what Arsenal were once known for? They deserved to win, no complaints unlike the last match we played in Manchester. Well done to them, maybe this is the kick Wenger needs.

As for Adebayor....good for him. He was right to leave because of the disgusting treatment he recieved from some Arsenal fans. I always liked him and thought highly of him as a striker, but now he's playing with more hunger and it looks as though he's happy. His celebration was silly, but at least he was apologised. The energy between him and Bellamy was unrivalled, constantly coming back to defend and at the same time picking up a goal each. Did he mar that good work by the 'stamp' on Van Persie? I don't think stamped, Adebayor has big feet and if he wanted to hurt Robin then he wouldn't have missed. Plus, he's more honest than that....I don't think he would ever go out of his way to hurt a friend.

To conclude, if Manchester City continue with that type of performance they will break into the top four to replace Arsenal, and it's likely to happen this season. My Arsenal...we need to spend more money and sort out that midfield. Please Wenger, make this our last bad season.

Oh and the rest of the matches....couldn't give a shit.

[proofreeder]

Hey Cian,

great, unbiased post.

As usual, my disclaimer that I don't watch nearly enough EPL games, which is killing me, I mainly know the players through CL, internationals and EPL when I used to have fox.

Re: Fabregas - You could well be right. Being a great player is completely different to being a great captain. Whereas being a great player is in large part due to technical, being a great captain is mental, emotional and just being a good leader.

Re: Viera - there is a reason players like Viera are one of the most highly sought after players in professional football. Their heart and their drive change games, they never give up, men playing amongst boys. Viera, Makele, Essien, Keane. Zidane once stated Makele was Real Madrid's MVP, even amidst the Galacticos, and Zidane is as smart a player there is (although also very humble - he was Real's MVP but he would not admit that).

Re: Van Persie - I like RVP, he's just a bit one-footed for me to be a "superstar striker". I'm sure others would argue that.

Re: Man City - Money talks. Money buys not only brilliant players, but also players with heart. If you see a player with heart, you factor that in to your offer. Therefore, money not only changes the ability of the team, but also the philosophy. That is, if you spend wisely.

Re: Arsenal's spending - lol. Every team needs to spend more (excepting Chelsea/Man City/Real etc). But the problem is, do they have the money? With teams being backed by billionaires nowadays, funds derived from non-football related businesses being injected into the leagues means players prices are going through the roof. Therefore, an increase in costs combined with a static or slower increase in revenue results in larger discrepencies between the haves and have nots. They need a salary cap badly, and I'm pretty sure Sepp Blatter feels the same way. Wenger is still doing amazingly well for me.

Well, that's all I had... or at least all I was willing to spend time writing. I could talk football forever.

[Cian]

But the problem is, do they have the money?

We're one of the few teams that are self-sustained. Last time I checked, we weren't in debt. We sold Adebayor and Touré and only bought Vermaelen for £10m. We made a profit over the summer...my best guess is that they're trying to build up funds after the expenditure that went towards our new stadium. Either that or Wenger is a stubborn bastard. I can understand not settling for a second rate player, he'll only buy a player better than he already has....that's understandable, but it sometimes it looks as though he isn't trying very hard.

And yeah, some sort of a cap is definitely needed; not only for wages but for transfers too. £80 million for Ronaldo is obscene, and so far he's been a flop, completely overshadowed by Kaka and Benzema. Finance in football is getting out of control.

[Jabbz]

Not sure if you all know this or not, but One are showing Serie A and Bundesliga matches now. 4.30 tomorrow morning is a seria A game, forget who is playing though. But still, free to air TV with football.... more often! Can only be a good thing :)

[proofreeder]

We're one of the few teams that are self-sustained. Last time I checked, we weren't in debt. We sold Adebayor and Touré and only bought Vermaelen for £10m. We made a profit over the summer...my best guess is that they're trying to build up funds after the expenditure that went towards our new stadium. Either that or Wenger is a stubborn bastard. I can understand not settling for a second rate player, he'll only buy a player better than he already has....that's understandable, but it sometimes it looks as though he isn't trying very hard.

And yeah, some sort of a cap is definitely needed; not only for wages but for transfers too. £80 million for Ronaldo is obscene, and so far he's been a flop, completely overshadowed by Kaka and Benzema. Finance in football is getting out of control.

I think every team should be self-sustained. But I'm an idealist lol. Where do all the millions (billions?) injected into football teams from outside revenues end up? Players? I don't mean that to be a rhetorical question either. Even without oil and resource tycoons (and organised crime!) injecting excess "play" money in competition with each other, there is enough money in football!

I'm not as familiar with Arsenal's finances as you, but I think Wenger's a smart guy. I'm sure he's trying hard lol, it's probably just difficult to find that diamond when everyone else can throw cash at any player with half-decent potential. Did you guys pay alot for Arshavin? Maybe you needed funds for that. I know next to nothing about football finances, but when he's competing against non-"selfsufficient teams" I would imagine he needs to be choosey?

I was mainly talking about a transfer cap rather than salary, but both is probably needed. As you stated, the transfers are insane. I think self-sufficiency would be a tremendous way to limit spending and transfers but how hard would that be to regulate? To be honest, I wouldn't have a clue, but it's probably unfeasible.

It will be really sad if Arsenal gets knocked out of the CL by Man $ity. It's just becoming who has the biggest financial backer with the most amount of money they're willing to throw away.

Also, I only found out Benzema was bought by Real today watching CL magazine (I haven't watched much football with my broken leg - too frustrating). Benzema is the shit! He is so two footed, he is going to be an absolute superstar. With Benzema, Kaka and Ronaldo, man, Real are going to be absolutely insane. And unlike other players, Kaka's humility will prevent him from losing his drive IMO. Same with Benzema, I couldn't think of three better buys, but where the hell do Real get all their money from? They are a bottomless pit! Very interesting to see how the brilliant short passing game of Barca fares against the genius of Real.

Not sure if you all know this or not, but One are showing Serie A and Bundesliga matches now. 4.30 tomorrow morning is a seria A game, forget who is playing though. But still, free to air TV with football.... more often! Can only be a good thing

Sweeeeeeeet! Thanks for letting me know, Jabbz. I'm gonna start getting into Serie A. Man, I wish they could show EPL though...

[goog]

Cian did u watch the whole match ? I disagree with u about Song i thought he was one of our better players on the day and i dont know how u can call carlos vela rubbish he is 20 years old and has only played about 20 games for us. I dont know what it is about city they smashed us last season 4-0 i think it was and yeah they did show more heart. I do think that Adebayor should be punished for inciteing the crowd it is poor sportsmanship and is even dangerous and he did make contact with RvP and RvP has said that he thinks adebayor stamped on him so i think they should look into it, I like to think it was not on purpose.

[Newton]

Yeah calling Vela rubbish is ridiculous.

Not much to say, besides that you should never be saying good on Adebayor. He is an absolute disgrace for his behaviour, got what he deserved from the fans after courting a move away to get more money, then when he got it not even nearly justifying it. The stamp on Van Persie's face was disgusting. He could have blinded him.

He could have incited a riot after scoring and running the length of the pitch. Didn't someone get killed a couple of weeks ago at the West Ham Millwall match? I'm sorry, but anyone who says good on him, it's OK, he apologised, is absolutely clueless.

The scoreline was flattering. A draw would have been fair on balance of play. The annoying thing was that Arsenal waited until 4-1 down to hit the post and have two shots cleared off the line. Barry handballed in the box too.

What struck me most about yesterday was how bad Clichy was. Three of City's goals came from him overcommitting. Give Gibbs a go. The next ten or so games aren't too bad.

I disagree with comments on Arsenal's midfield. Song was good. Denilson is a bench player when Nasri gets back. Rosicky might eventually get fit too, although dealing in mights and might nots isn't great really. I still think this could be a good season. After the Everton game Arsenal were amazing. After two undeserved losses they're not awful. Perspective is a hell of a thing.

Also, Man U were impressive. I was happy to see Spurs knocked off their perch a little bit ;)

And my 'Not much to say' proved to be inaccurate, looking back at the length of my post.

[proofreeder]

6 games of CL on SBS 1 and 2. Nice. I'm really keen to see how Real plays. Inter Vs Barca will be interesting after their "trade" also.

[Cian]

Cian did u watch the whole match ? I disagree with u about Song i thought he was one of our better players on the day and i dont know how u can call carlos vela rubbish he is 20 years old and has only played about 20 games for us. I dont know what it is about city they smashed us last season 4-0 i think it was and yeah they did show more heart. I do think that Adebayor should be punished for inciteing the crowd it is poor sportsmanship and is even dangerous and he did make contact with RvP and RvP has said that he thinks adebayor stamped on him so i think they should look into it, I like to think it was not on purpose.

Yeah I watched all of it, every agonising minute. I've never rated Song, his passing lets him down. As for Vela, I've only seen about half of his performances, but he lacks confidence and he needs to build it soon. You're saying he's only twenty years of age, well...Fabregas established himself at the age of eighteen. Granted, Fabregas is EXCEPTIONAL but I still expect more from Vela considering how highly you all rate him.

Yeah calling Vela rubbish is ridiculous.

Not much to say, besides that you should never be saying good on Adebayor. He is an absolute disgrace for his behaviour, got what he deserved from the fans after courting a move away to get more money, then when he got it not even nearly justifying it. The stamp on Van Persie's face was disgusting. He could have blinded him.

He could have incited a riot after scoring and running the length of the pitch. Didn't someone get killed a couple of weeks ago at the West Ham Millwall match? I'm sorry, but anyone who says good on him, it's OK, he apologised, is absolutely clueless.

The scoreline was flattering. A draw would have been fair on balance of play. The annoying thing was that Arsenal waited until 4-1 down to hit the post and have two shots cleared off the line. Barry handballed in the box too.

What struck me most about yesterday was how bad Clichy was. Three of City's goals came from him overcommitting. Give Gibbs a go. The next ten or so games aren't too bad.

I disagree with comments on Arsenal's midfield. Song was good. Denilson is a bench player when Nasri gets back. Rosicky might eventually get fit too, although dealing in mights and might nots isn't great really. I still think this could be a good season. After the Everton game Arsenal were amazing. After two undeserved losses they're not awful. Perspective is a hell of a thing.

Also, Man U were impressive. I was happy to see Spurs knocked off their perch a little bit ;)

And my 'Not much to say' proved to be inaccurate, looking back at the length of my post.

I guess we had to disagree sometime Newton...

In relation to Adebayor. I looked at the stamping incident again yesterday, in slow motion. There was definitely intent, I wasn't able to pick it up during the live game. But now there's no doubt in my mind, and I'll be shocked if he doesn't get a suspension. As for his falling out at Arsenal....he had a great season in 2008, scoring thirty goals I think it was? It was to be expected that he would want more money, Van Persie isn't an angel either. He got increased wages with his new deal and is known to lash out in a tackle because of frustration. So, Adebayor got more money and he had a sub-par season. The 'fans' turned on him far too quickly, especially considering we had a lot of poor performers last year, Fabregas included.

Anyway, back to Saturday. I'm not going to lie, if I was in his shoes I would have done the exact same thing (except for the stamp). I would never condone what he did and I agree, it could have sparked violence and that's the last thing we need. At the same time, what he did is understandable simply because of emotion. And to me, he's certainly not a devil. I still think he gave his best for Arsenal when he was here and I think we cashed in at the right time. I'm still suprised at the stamp though....what was he thinking? It'll be interesting to see how it plays out after the FA are finished looking at it. Three match ban is my guess, possibly a fine too.

Onto the scoreline. You can't be serious about deserving a draw surely? Any team that defended like we did and concede four goals, doesn't deserve anything from a match. Yeah we hit the post and Adebayor cleared off the line. The Barry handball would have been a harsh decision. But Man City had a couple of chances too, remember Ade's amazing run into the box? I think it was Phillips who missed the chance but either way, it should have been a goal. Ireland had a chance on the counter but his brainless head left him very confused. We collapsed after bellamy's goal because (and I'll say it again), we don't have a good captain....a great player yes, captain no. Anyhoo, I still don't think we didn't deserve anything out of the game.

Clichy, that's the one of the worst games I've seen him play in. It was especially suprising because he's been so consistent for years and is one of our more reliable defensive players. But our only alternative is Gibbs, and he made a lot of mistakes in key games last year...I don't think I've ever seen someone slip as much as he did. To be honest, I'd rather let Clichy regain his confidence over the next few games before playing Gibbs.

The Everton and Fulham games, whoop dee doo. They were great for Arsenal fans, goals a plenty. But looking back (especially with Everton), they were ****ing terrible and hardly a test for us. Everyone knows we can demolish fragile teams, we can rip them to pieces. I think we need to bring in a Vieira-type in January to deal with the big boys, I've been saying that since Flamini left but Wenger doesn't seem to agree.

I dunno....it's going to be a very interesting season and I'm looking forward to see how Arsenal react in the coming games, and whether Man City can sustain this impressive start. Until next week.

(I think I answered everything there)

[Jabbz]

6 games of CL on SBS 1 and 2. Nice. I'm really keen to see how Real plays. Inter Vs Barca will be interesting after their "trade" also.

Ahhh, my DVDR is going to be working overtime with Champ league, and One..... WEE! Add to that NBA in about a month, I wont have time to watch it all!

[goog]

You're saying he's only twenty years of age, well...Fabregas established himself at the age of eighteen. Granted, Fabregas is EXCEPTIONAL but I still expect more from Vela considering how highly you all rate him.


Im not saying i rate him highly at all but u can't call him rubbish if u have not seen him play enough. twenty is young,very few players are first team at that age.

I dont know about banning Adebayor for running to the arsenal fans but i think he should be fined or have some kind of punnishment. In saying that he should get a lenghty ban for his stamp if they deem it intentional. The way he acted was unprofessional. Edwardro gets two games for diveing so what is the punnishment for kicking someone in the head ? That is the kind of thing that to me doesnt make sense

[autologic]

Eduardo ban overturned (http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,26075960-2722,00.html)

[grimace06]

I don't know how you can intentionally stamp someone with a boot on and not break their cheek bone or eye socket.

Also, I thought Adebayor was in his right to run to the fans - they were shit to him.

[proofreeder]

Real tomorrow, I'm psyched to see how Ronaldo, Kaka and Benzemma play together. No one better be injured/rested!

[autologic]

Manchester derby was fantastic. I wanted City to win but United probably deserved it in the end, they were all over City for pretty much the whole second half.

[Cian]

Manchester derby was fantastic. I wanted City to win but United probably deserved it in the end, they were all over City for pretty much the whole second half.

Queue a typical biased response from grimace. I'm surprised he hasn't posted yet.

[grimace06]

Queue a typical biased response from grimace. I'm surprised he hasn't posted yet.

Oh yes I'm the biased one - lest I endure another Arsenal lovefest in this thread. One week when they win you love them and Wenger is genius and then when they lose its "replace that player, he's not a good captain, buy new players etc". Every week I see certain people complain about results going against the run of play going unnoticed - yet when I voice my annoyance when Liverpool and co are outplayed for 92 minutes only to rob Stoke, Hull, Sunderland et al of 2-3 points I get criticised.

Anyway, great win tonight - we destroyed them in the 2nd Half and deserved all 3 points. Evra is a gun.

[proofreeder]

Staying out of the argument, me and my mate have always liked Evra, I thought he was fantastic on the left. Sometimes he didn't get into games though (the one's we watched), maybe the departure of Ronaldo has opened up opportunities for him?

[Pauly]

great game. my dad and i woke up the rest of the house when owen scored. some really bad defense by both oshea and ferdinand almost cost us the game. evra was superb. berbatov was unlucky not to score a couple of times. tevez should have put one away too but was denied by the post. i didn't like the crowd booing at him though. very one eyed.

oh and bellamy's goal was amazing :)

[goog]

I thought Man u made a huge mistake when i first saw evra play, how wrong i was

[Newton]

I thought they were right to boo Tevez. You can't defect to a team's cross town rivals, then constantly criticise the team's manager (the best and most successful they have ever had) and expect not to hear backlash. Tevez vs Ferguson? If I were a United fan I know who I'd be cheering.

Also, Owen's finish was brilliant and that was one of the best finishes to a match in a long long time.

Making lengthy posts from the iPhone is tricky, so in conclusion, Vermaelen's second was an absolute cracker.

[Cian]

Oh yes I'm the biased one - lest I endure another Arsenal lovefest in this thread. One week when they win you love them and Wenger is genius and then when they lose its "replace that player, he's not a good captain, buy new players etc". Every week I see certain people complain about results going against the run of play going unnoticed - yet when I voice my annoyance when Liverpool and co are outplayed for 92 minutes only to rob Stoke, Hull, Sunderland et al of 2-3 points I get criticised.

Maybe you don't understand the meaning of bias. Ahem;

Bias is a term used to describe a tendency or preference towards a particular perspective, ideology or result, especially when the tendency interferes with the ability to be impartial, unprejudiced, or objective.[1]. In other words, bias is generally seen as 'one-sided'. The term biased is used to describe an action, judgment, or other outcome influenced by a prejudged perspective. It is also used to refer to a person or body of people whose actions or judgments exhibit bias. The term "biased" is often used as a pejorative, because bias is inherently unjust, lacking merit.

If I was to praise Arsenal one week and criticize a poor performance following that, wouldn't I be 'un-biased'? You didn't see me praise Arsenal midweek, did you? That's because they didn't deserve any. Good spirit but a poor performance.

As fans, we're entitled to voice opinions on the manager and squad. Find me an Arsenal fan who doesn't want to strengthen defensively and I'll find you a referee that will give a penalty to the opposition at Old Trafford. We'll both fail miserably.

I'm just fed up with the amount of luck you guys get at home, it's far more one sided in comparison to home games at Anfield, Stamford Bridge or The Emirates. The referees are scared shitless of angering the Old Trafford faithful.

And for the record, Wenger is a footballing genius. If you hear an analyst that disagrees and you will have found a bullshitter.

Anyway, here's hoping the title won't be in Manchester next May.

[grimace06]

Maybe you don't understand the meaning of bias. Ahem;



If I was to praise Arsenal one week and criticize a poor performance following that, wouldn't I be 'un-biased'? You didn't see me praise Arsenal midweek, did you? That's because they didn't deserve any. Good spirit but a poor performance.

As fans, we're entitled to voice opinions on the manager and squad. Find me an Arsenal fan who doesn't want to strengthen defensively and I'll find you a referee that will give a penalty to the opposition at Old Trafford. We'll both fail miserably.

I'm just fed up with the amount of luck you guys get at home, it's far more one sided in comparison to home games at Anfield, Stamford Bridge or The Emirates. The referees are scared shitless of angering the Old Trafford faithful.

And for the record, Wenger is a footballing genius. If you hear an analyst that disagrees and you will have found a bullshitter.

Anyway, here's hoping the title won't be in Manchester next May.

First of all, my comment about Arsenal fans had nothing to do with bias - more the fact that in amongst of all the other stuff that goes on in this thread my posts get singled out and I get criticised.

Secondly, we did not get lucky - Man City would've been lucky to get a point considering we destroyed them in the 2nd half and if it wasn't for Shea Given and the idiocy of Foster and Ferdinand it would've been ugly.

Thirdly, I don't where all this talk of too much injury time comes from. It was four minutes minimum with a minute added for the goal, thirty seconds for the sub.

[Cian]

First of all, my comment about Arsenal fans had nothing to do with bias - more the fact that in amongst of all the other stuff that goes on in this thread my posts get singled out and I get criticised.

Secondly, we did not get lucky - Man City would've been lucky to get a point considering we destroyed them in the 2nd half and if it wasn't for Shea Given and the idiocy of Foster and Ferdinand it would've been ugly.

Thirdly, I don't where all this talk of too much injury time comes from. It was four minutes minimum with a minute added for the goal, thirty seconds for the sub.

I wasn't specifically referring to that match in terms of luck, I meant it in a general sense. Even look at the Arsenal match, plenty of luck right there with Rooney's dive....ironic coming from a self-proclaimed honest player.

(lolololololololololololololololololololololololol olololololololololololololololololololololol...lol )

The reason you get singled out is because you sound arrogant when Man Utd win. I don't ever remember you giving any credit to an opposing team, or showing them respect. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

[proofreeder]

Re: Tevez, I haven't followed his comments on Ferguson.

However, IMO he had every right to defect. He was playing better than Berbatov and still wasn't getting a game. He "defected" to a team who paid him and played him more. As for cross town rivals, I'm sure players aren't as concerned about that as fans. He shouldn't be booed for that. What do fans expect him to do, hang around on a team that doesn't play him sufficiently, just for the greater good of Man U?

I can't say whether he should be booed for Fergie comments because I haven't heard of them.

[Pauly]

you may be right newton but at the end of the day he had a contract which united didn't want to uphold. he may not have been worth the money but in the end his contract did say that he was to be paid a certain amount at the end of his loan if they wanted to keep him. and they refused. so i think he had every right to cause a bit of a stink. i still think he was great for us and i love watching him play, no matter what team.

cian, if grimace is so bad then be the bigger man and stfu. there's too much bs and not enough football discussion in this thread as it is.

[Cian]

cian, if grimace is so bad then be the bigger man and stfu. there's too much bs and not enough football discussion in this thread as it is.

Look back through the last three weeks and you'll see a lot of lengthy posts from me, all on topic. Myself and Newton could have written a thesis on Arsenal's start to the season.

Pauly...maybe look at yourself before telling me to shut the **** up.

I've yet to see you post more than four sentences in this thread. I even went to the hassle of checking, you've barely posted anything at all. So if you feel so strongly about discussing football....then maybe you should contribute more often?

[Pauly]

Feel better?

Back to the football, it was great to see Chelsea lose! United back on top :D

Also I thought Gerrard's goal was amazing. At first I wasn't sure if he meant it as it looked like a cross. But after seeing it again I believe it was a shot on goal. Pure class.

[grimace06]

What a disgusting performance from Man U - barely deserved that point.

I knew we'd struggle as soon as Giggs was left out.

[Jay]

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=682490&sec=england&cc=3888

Seriously, does he ever show any grace? EVER? Maybe have a look at what was a pretty sub-standard team performance, Sir Alex, not to mention a couple of dubious managerial decisions. What? Can't take the blame yourself? Of course not.

[Jabbz]

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=682490&sec=england&cc=3888

Seriously, does he ever show any grace? EVER? Maybe have a look at what was a pretty sub-standard team performance, Sir Alex, not to mention a couple of dubious managerial decisions. What? Can't take the blame yourself? Of course not.

"Our passing was very poor in the first half. In the end we needed to show some great qualities to get something out of the game on a day when we played really badly.''

If you read, he didn't blame the ref for the draw. He complained about his fitness and thats it.

And WOW at the Arsenal game. Some impressive things.... Would have rathered Chelsea and Liverpool drew.

[Pauly]

To be fair. They are indeed meant to add time on for goals scored/injuries/subs in extra time. And if you read on as Jabbz did, you would see that he didn't just think the ref was the only problem with the game.

Once again people just love to hate the man for no reason. Nothing he did was wrong.

[Jay]

I did read the whole article. How you can say that it comes off as anything other than sour grapes, or a feeble attempt to divert attention away from some poor decisions, is astonishing.

[Jabbz]

Quite easily, but then again, I'm a Man U fan.

A manager wanting a ref sacked. (http://theworldgame.sbs.com.au/english-premier-league/big-sam-wants-ref-axed-242107)

THAT, is a manager blaming a ref and seems rather obvious to me. How can the quote above I posted not reveal that he isn't deflecting a bad game? "We played really badly" about sums it up, right?

[Jay]

I'm a Chelsea fan and it used to drive me bonkers when Mourinho opened his mouth. As much as I enjoyed the success he helped bring to the club, the last six months under Hiddink and then Ancelotti, and the years under Ranieri always made me feel better because they seem managers capable of operating with grace and style, win, lose or draw. I don't see that in Ferguson. I didn't see it in Mourinho and I don't see it in Ferguson.

[grimace06]

I'm a Chelsea fan and it used to drive me bonkers when Mourinho opened his mouth. As much as I enjoyed the success he helped bring to the club, the last six months under Hiddink and then Ancelotti, and the years under Ranieri always made me feel better because they seem managers capable of operating with grace and style, win, lose or draw. I don't see that in Ferguson. I didn't see it in Mourinho and I don't see it in Ferguson.

Ferguson has always been vocal and that what makes him the legend that he is, I don't always agree with what he says but atleast he doesn't prepare a letter to read out at a press conference that attempts mind games towards another team and fails miserably (Benitez) or say the only way to beat his team is to kick them (Wenger).

FTR, I felt very sorry for Ranieri when he got sacked - good coach out of luck.

[Jay]

Seems I'm not the only one who thought he was out of line.

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=682978&sec=england&cc=3888

And just for a bit of light reading...

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/feature?id=683005&sec=englandopinion&cc=3888

[Pauly]

I think you'll find such rants by most managers at some point. Some more than others. It just depends how often crap happens to their team. My opinion is that in most cases they are reactions. I think Furgie is justified in feeling passionate about decisions that go against him. Sometimes he may take it too far though. It's interesting because Mark Hughes had a similar rant after the Manchester derby last month. I guess it only matters for repeat offenders.

[Jay]

Oh no doubt all managers are guilty of it at some point. As I said earlier Mourinho used to be embarrassing. My objection to Ferguson is that he seems virtually incapable of dropping points with any grace.

[Jay]

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=684163&sec=england&cc=3888

And as a follow up...

[Blue]

Ferguson has always been vocal and that what makes him the legend that he is, I don't always agree with what he says but atleast he doesn't prepare a letter to read out at a press conference that attempts mind games towards another team and fails miserably (Benitez) or say the only way to beat his team is to kick them (Wenger).

FTR, I felt very sorry for Ranieri when he got sacked - good coach out of luck.Yeah … If Benitez or Wenger had said the same thing, you would have abused them. You're so one-eyed it's embarrassing. You're that guy at the pub who nobody wants to talk football with.

[grimace06]

Yeah … If Benitez or Wenger had said the same thing, you would have abused them. You're so one-eyed it's embarrassing. You're that guy at the pub who nobody wants to talk football with.

Like I said Blue, I don't agree with everything Ferguson says.

I don't feel embarrased - I simply brought up facts. I never disagreed with Jay that Ferguson could be out of line sometimes - I simply appreciate his honesty instead of speaking in cryptic mind games that many other managers engage in. The two examples of Benitez and Wenger I brought up are the absolute truth.

Also, you seem to neglect to differ from the discussion of football in general and one's reaction of a result after a match. A big part of football is about emotion, Blue. There is a place for both one-eyed jeering and unbiased discussion.

[Jay]

Anyone see the Sunderland beachball goal? :) Life's a beach sometimes, Reds.

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=686239&sec=england&cc=3436

Also, Chelsea, ffs please learn to defend set pieces. Retarded.

[Jabbz]

I saw that goal and could not help but laugh. And laugh, and Laugh.

Funny Reds supporter, throwing the ball!

[Newton]

Looks like my Liverpool prediction is on course (a while back I suggested he was the difference between first and fourth - Liverpool are currently eighth). It wasn't just because I don't like Liverpool.

They have a weak squad (no depth at all) and selling Alonso was so silly. The back four don't look too comfortable without him there, and his playmaking abilities were there for all to see.

Oh well. We'll see what Aquilani brings, but by then it will surely be too late.

Also, Birmingham fans chanting "there's only one Martin Taylor" after Ridgewell (fairly, granted) went through Walcott was beyond disgusting. Eduardo was at the match. I'm sure he would've liked hearing that. Given the lack of previous between the two clubs, it was surprising that they behaved so disgracefully. Disappointing, humanity.

[grimace06]

Looks like my Liverpool prediction is on course (a while back I suggested he was the difference between first and fourth - Liverpool are currently eighth). It wasn't just because I don't like Liverpool.

They have a weak squad (no depth at all) and selling Alonso was so silly. The back four don't look too comfortable without him there, and his playmaking abilities were there for all to see.

Oh well. We'll see what Aquilani brings, but by then it will surely be too late.

Also, Birmingham fans chanting "there's only one Martin Taylor" after Ridgewell (fairly, granted) went through Walcott was beyond disgusting. Eduardo was at the match. I'm sure he would've liked hearing that. Given the lack of previous between the two clubs, it was surprising that they behaved so disgracefully. Disappointing, humanity.

Poor form.

Speaking of poor form, how bout Liverpool?

[Pauly]

I can't believe the referee didn't call for a drop ball. I would be dirty if I was a supporter. Do you think the kid that hit the ball onto the field got bashed at school?

[proofreeder]

I haven't seen it, but yeah, it's pretty obvious there needs to be a rule, if external objects interfere with play the game is halted. How obvious is that? Sheer ridiculousness.

[goog]

i think the goal should stand it isnt like Bent aimed for the beachball and i wonder what people would be saying if it had of stoped the goal from going in ?

[Jay]

I just hope it's included as a skill move in Fifa '11.

[Newton]

There is a rule. The ref is just an idiot.

[Blue]

The commentators led me to believe that it was Reina's fault for not removing the obstruction. Seems like bullshit to me. Pretty hilarious result though.

[grimace06]

The commentators led me to believe that it was Reina's fault for not removing the obstruction. Seems like bullshit to me. Pretty hilarious result though.

Seeing as it came on to pitch during a stoppage, why didn't anyone - let alone Reina - kick it away? This doesn't please me as you'll likely hit back hard this week (last year's game at Anfield you had no Gerrard or Torres like now).

Also, being from Liverpool that kid is probably in the ICU atm.

[proofreeder]

A friend informed me that particular referee was demoted to div 2 for allowing such a ridiculous goal to stand.

[Jay]

It's the same old song... :)

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=689387&sec=england&cc=3888

[grimace06]

It's the same old song... :)

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=689387&sec=england&cc=3888

Well done Liverpool - Torres is class.

But Jay, heres the thing - it was a terrible decision.

That was a straight red anywhere in the world. Vidic was sent off for the exact same thing. He also escaped giving away a penalty due to the ref being in a poor position.

Not to mention that Lucas escaped about half a dozen cards and it took a ridiculous lunge to get that rat Mascherano in the dressing room.

I saw the result coming - when you play the exact side that traveled to Moscow in mid-week you're going to struggle.

Ferguson needs to realise that Torres is way too quick for both Ferdinand and Vidic and drop someone in front of the back four to stifle his run.

[Jay]

You know what, though, irrespective of the quality of the decision, it was the ref's, and he made it. Ferguson's decision to play the exact same side as travelled to Moscow, or not have a back up plan for Torres, were also shithouse, but I don't see the ref coming out and criticising him.

You get bad decisions. You get them all the time. Just as you get plenty of decisions that go your way. The classy thing to do is to SUCK IT UP, KEEP YOUR MOUTH SHUT and GIVE SOME CREDIT TO THE OPPOSITION (which admittedly he does, but not until after he's had a whinge).

[grimace06]

You know what, though, irrespective of the quality of the decision, it was the ref's, and he made it. Ferguson's decision to play the exact same side as travelled to Moscow, or not have a back up plan for Torres, were also shithouse, but I don't see the ref coming out and criticising him.

You get bad decisions. You get them all the time. Just as you get plenty of decisions that go your way. The classy thing to do is to SUCK IT UP, KEEP YOUR MOUTH SHUT and GIVE SOME CREDIT TO THE OPPOSITION (which admittedly he does, but not until after he's had a whinge).

Developing a bit of a complex are we Jay? :p

We've got Chelsea at Stamford Bridge in two weeks and I'm hoping for a more spirited performance than last night.

[Jay]

Ha ha, I reckon Fergie's the one with the complex. :p

That should be a cracking game. Maybe we should have a Fifa10 showdown as a warm-up...

[grimace06]

Oh wow.

Liverpool implode at Craven Cottage 3-1 and down to 9 men. Benitez loses the plot and takes off Torres, Kuyt and Benayoun in the last 20 minutes. One step foward, two steps back.

Chelsea crush Bolton 4-0. Next.

Arsenal beat Tottenham 3-0 including the 2nd goal straight from the kickoff after the first. Nothing ever changes for Spurs.

Man U comfortably beat Blackburn with Berba and Rooney both scoring and Obertan making a promising debut.

[Blue]

Benitez needs the sack after this game. TWO inexperienced defenders start, along with ****ing Voronin, and then he takes off our three best goal-makers when we need goals, and gives another rookie a run. It was a farcical managerial display, and shows that he always gets carried away preparing for European games, and forgets about what should be the main focus, the ****ING LEAGUE. Arrogant prick. Season over. Sack him.

[Newton]

Love you Fabregas. Seriously should've been five nil.

[Blue]

He's really stood out this year, and not just because Ronaldo and Gerrard haven't done much. I mean, he's obviously always been a great player, but he just seems to have come into his own lately.

[Jay]

Bloody United getting out of jail. ****.

And once more, with feeling...

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=693590&sec=uefachampionsleague&cc=3436

Great late goal from Atletico to draw with Chelsea too.

[grimace06]

Bloody United getting out of jail. ****.

And once more, with feeling...

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=693590&sec=uefachampionsleague&cc=3436

Great late goal from Atletico to draw with Chelsea too.

Are you writing these articles, Jay? :p

[Jay]

That's the thing - if I was, I could understand people thinking I had a vendetta. But I am merely reflecting what EVERYONE who is not a Man U supporter, or somehow otherwise inside the arse of the most arrogant man in world football, thinks. He is a graceless cockhead who needs to be sanctioned, slapped and generally kicked up the arse. For the good of the game. :p

[grimace06]

That's the thing - if I was, I could understand people thinking I had a vendetta. But I am merely reflecting what EVERYONE who is not a Man U supporter, or somehow otherwise inside the arse of the most arrogant man in world football, thinks. He is a graceless cockhead who needs to be sanctioned, slapped and generally kicked up the arse. For the good of the game. :p

Hey I don't like it that much - I would prefer him to vent to his players and drive them to another CL win. But I would argue that 90% of the time coaches that lose or have decisions go against them complain in their press conferences - Fergie gets reported on more because people don't like him for his past outbursts, its a vicious cycle.

[Jay]

Yeah, you're probably right. It's just fun to highlight it. ;)

[grimace06]

Robbed. Absolutely robbed.

More of the play, more chances and we cop a goal from a free that wasn't there.

Rooney was immense, we defended well and we deserved points.

[Jay]

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=696078&sec=england&cc=3436

:)

Seems their supporters can't lose with any grace either... ^_^

I haven't seen the game, but the soccernet match report suggests United should have had a player sent off, and that Chelsea did a good share of the attacking. The goal was possibly contentious - certainly the free kick that led to the goal, anyway - but the report does not in any way suggest United were robbed.

[grimace06]

http://www.foxsports.com.au/story/0,8659,26323481-29437,00.html

There you go Jay - straight off the bat a wrong offside decision, Terry gets away with pulling Valencia down and not one highlight of a Chelsea chance on goal.

I mean, it was still an interesting match - what with Drogba getting shot with a shotgun and all.

[grimace06]

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=697528&sec=england&cc=3436

Very interesting - its only one side of it but makes me feel sorry for Nani and every other player the world in that same situation.

[Jay]

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=697574&sec=england&cc=3436

About ****ing time.

[grimace06]

Old news :p

But to be honest - judging from the poor officiating in our past few matches theres already been a reaction to his comments that hurts more than a touchline ban.

[Jay]

Congratulations to the Kiwis for making the World Cup Finals for the first time since 1982. I remember how awesome it was when we made it for the first time in years last time. Well done!

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/report?id=284592&cc=3436

@ grimace

The whole league is NOT against you. There are no conspiracies, no backroom meetings where people in dark glasses and black suits decide that Man U should be ****ed up the arse. Similarly in AFL circles. As much as we all hate Port Adelaide - and believe me, we do :p - there is no directive to **** them up.

[grimace06]

Congratulations to the Kiwis for making the World Cup Finals for the first time since 1982. I remember how awesome it was when we made it for the first time in years last time. Well done!

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/report?id=284592&cc=3436

@ grimace

The whole league is NOT against you. There are no conspiracies, no backroom meetings where people in dark glasses and black suits decide that Man U should be ****ed up the arse. Similarly in AFL circles. As much as we all hate Port Adelaide - and believe me, we do :p - there is no directive to **** them up.

While nobody is against us, there is a collective want of the whole footballing community to see Manchester United - not just because of the obvious wanting to win but also jealousy of their success. Mostly from from people involved in Arsenal, Liverpool and evem Leeds United.

Do you not think Fergusons comments had an effect on the referees - when he pretty insulted their entire faculty?

[Blue]

Seriously grimace06, you're paranoid about everybody hating Manchester United, and you're constantly attacking their rivals at every opportunity. You're a hypocrite.

[Jay]

While nobody is against us, there is a collective want of the whole footballing community to see Manchester United - not just because of the obvious wanting to win but also jealousy of their success. Mostly from from people involved in Arsenal, Liverpool and evem Leeds United.

Do you not think Fergusons comments had an effect on the referees - when he pretty insulted their entire faculty?

No I don't. I think the kind of scrutiny they are under that the referees would be at pains to be as professional as possible at all times. They may make mistakes, but to suggest that there is an underlying bias is just not true. You sound like Collingwood supporters, and you don't want to sound like them. :p

[grimace06]

Seriously grimace06, you're paranoid about everybody hating Manchester United, and you're constantly attacking their rivals at every opportunity. You're a hypocrite.

I never attacked anybody - in fact if you looked at the posts above I was stating my opinion about a general trend in the refereeing and how they relate to Ferguson.

I've lost count how many times I've people say "Man U get everything their way, they get X amount of penalties all the time and Fergie has the officials in his back pocket meaning they get more injury time" So now that I'm basing my opinion on the result of Fergusons statements coupled with two atrocious refereeing displays at Anfield and Stamford Bridge, you're calling me a hypocrite?

Next time you watch your bi-monthly game of football, pay attention for a change.

Also Jay - no I don't want to be a Collingwood supporter :p and ftr Australia just stole the points off Oman at the death while being dominated and 10-men.

[Jay]

Shit really? I last heard the score at 1 - 0 to Oman. How did it finish?

[grimace06]

Shit really? I last heard the score at 1 - 0 to Oman. How did it finish?

We equalised late in the first half, then in the second half Oman ran all over us - they 4 chances cleared off the line and a very strong hand ball in the box dismissed.

In the 88th minute Kewell chips it to Carney who crosses to Emerton who hits first time and scores.

After that tempers flared and the referee had to break up multiple scuffles and some idiot threw fireworks onto the pitch.

Right now I'm waiting for Greece vs Ukraine to start - should be interesting.

[proofreeder]

What the hell... how did NZ make it into the WC? Australia couldn't make it for 30 years and now NZ waltz in... I always said Asia's the easiest way to qualify and this proves it. And to think Asia were asking for another half a spot the world cup before last, maybe so Togo could make it. I probably should be happy for them but when teams like Portugal might not make it in and NZ waltz in...

And Grimace, just out of interest, are you saying Man U receives worse than average treatment or the same treatment as everyone else but people say they don't?

[grimace06]

What the hell... how did NZ make it into the WC? Australia couldn't make it for 30 years and now NZ waltz in... I always said Asia's the easiest way to qualify and this proves it. And to think Asia were asking for another half a spot the world cup before last, maybe so Togo could make it. I probably should be happy for them but when teams like Portugal might not make it in and NZ waltz in...

And Grimace, just out of interest, are you saying Man U receives worse than average treatment or the same treatment as everyone else but people say they don't?

It's not surprising New Zealand made the World Cup - they're the big dog in Oceania now since Australia moved to Asia and they changed the system so they don't have to play the 4th ranked team in South America.

I don't want to continue the topic much longer but I was saying theres a corellation between Ferguson's comments towards the referee faculty in the EPL and recent poor refereeing in recent games involving Man U and moreover that Ferguson should keep his mouth shut in the future.

[proofreeder]

Winning Oceania's to be expected from New Zealand, but the fact they beat Bahrain reflects extremely poorly on Asia. It's ridiculous, and that's what happens when you decide a world cup spot by a couple of games instead of a full schedule (Oceania qualification doesn't count).

Wasn't it the 5th ranked team in SA? And now Bahrain was the 5th ranked team in Asia right?

[Lazlow]

8TbBonXhTVI

[grimace06]

Holy shit Darren Fletcher.

[Jabbz]

Holy shit Darren Fletcher.

I agree...

And WOW!!! at Spurs. 9-1 against Wigan. Even though its Wigan, NINE GOALS! Wow.... Just, wow...

[autologic]

So glad I kept Defoe in my fantasy league team :D

[Jay]

Well that was pretty satisfying. 0 - 3 at the Emirates. :)

[grimace06]

Well that was pretty satisfying. 0 - 3 at the Emirates. :)

Arsenal are ****ed - they lack inspiration in the final third and their forwards were destroyed by Chelsea's defence.

On the other hand, Liverpool played liked donkeys and still came away with the points against Everton who dominated the match but missed their opportunities.

[grimace06]

Australia have been drawn in Group D with Germany, Ghana and Serbia for the 2010 World Cup.

A very tough group.

[Spazzallo]

Very tough. Though now we get to see what would have happened to the Aussies if Italy hadn't of knocked them out. A shame we didn't get England though!

Italy have New Zealand in their group so I'll just have to be content with them knocking the shit out of them!

Where can you find who will play who once we're up to the round of 16?

EDIT: Just found it. If Australia make it through to the second round (likely in second place of their group) they will pretty much definitely play ENGLAND in the round of 16! Then followed by a likely rematch with Italy.

[Rambo]

England are pushovers, I don't even know any of their players!












We're screwed.

[Choabac]

Damn AFL trying to c-block the FFA from possibly hosting the World Cup.

At least the NRL are willing to cooperate if they're given compensation.

[Jabbz]

I still can't help but laugh at at Liverpool being knocked out of the CL. Made me smile.

[Jay]

Thank you Gabby Agbonlahor. :)

[Newton]

While I'm sure Man U are thanking Petr Cech and Chelsea's defense that the gap wasn't wider.

It could be good for Arsenal, since winning tonight and their game in hand would out them within three points of Chelsea and level with United (if my calculations are correct) but their squad is ****ed at the moment, so it probably won't matter. Unless there is some cash outlay in January, which there won't be, so it probably won't matter.

Also I tipped Bolton vs City to be a score draw with a City player getting sent off. I am some kind of psychic!

And I didn't post in here for so long because I was convinced I was subscribed to this thread, so when it wasn't showing up in subscribed threads I thought it had died. It's OK. I'm here now. And I've subscribed.

[Lazlow]

So I'm watching the W-League on ABC, and while I want to be all positive reinforcement for women's divisions, the skills on display here are woeful.

[grimace06]

Villa are a good side they defended really well. While our defence is ravaged by injury.

I'm not too stressed - 3 points is nothing and Chelsea are losing a couple of players to the African Cup of Nations right?

[Newton]

Awww yeah.

[Jay]

Good work from Fulham. They must have played out of their skins. :)

And how much longer will Liverpool persist with Benitez. I understand the main reason he is still there is that they can't afford to pay him out.

[grimace06]

Good work from Fulham. They must have played out of their skins. :)

And how much longer will Liverpool persist with Benitez. I understand the main reason he is still there is that they can't afford to pay him out.

Fulham played and all their goals were well set up. We have a raft of injuries atm so I kind of expected a loss.The selections were also ridiculous - Carrick and Fletcher should not be playing in central defence, play young natural defenders there (if only we still had Pique), why was Giggs left out completely? why did Owen start? Why did Gibson start over Park?

[Jay]

Hasn't Gibson been in a rich vein of form the last few weeks? And Giggs probably needs managing, despite all the stories about how he's fitter than ever - it's a busy time of year and I challenge any 36 year old to play that much football.

[grimace06]

Hasn't Gibson been in a rich vein of form the last few weeks? And Giggs probably needs managing, despite all the stories about how he's fitter than ever - it's a busy time of year and I challenge any 36 year old to play that much football.

I would've thought Giggs would at least be on the bench.

May I also say that Paul Scholes played the worst match of his long career last night.

[autologic]

May I also say that Paul Scholes played the worst match of his long career last night.
Only saw the highlights, but his mistake that led to the first goal was terrible.

[Jay]

I don't often barrack for Leeds...but go you good things!!

[grimace06]

Well done Leeds - defended well and scored a nice goal.

Things need a changing at Old Trafford.

[Jabbz]

Man City to sign Viera? (http://www.theworldgame.com.au/english-premier-league/man-city-closing-in-on-vieira-275597)

Hmm, interesting.

[grimace06]

Man City to sign Viera? (http://www.theworldgame.com.au/english-premier-league/man-city-closing-in-on-vieira-275597)

Hmm, interesting.

He's signed.

http://www.theworldgame.com.au/english-premier-league/vieira-completes-city-move-275987

[goog]

Vieras wages must have been a problem for Arsenal, thats the only reason i can think of that they didnt sign him. He would be a perfect sub for Song while he is away with the african cup of nations.

Oh and did everyone hear about the attack on the Togo teams bus
http://www.theworldgame.com.au/africa/angola-to-step-up-security-276247

[grimace06]

Vieras wages must have been a problem for Arsenal, thats the only reason i can think of that they didnt sign him. He would be a perfect sub for Song while he is away with the african cup of nations.

Oh and did everyone hear about the attack on the Togo teams bus
http://www.theworldgame.com.au/africa/angola-to-step-up-security-276247

Thats pretty terrible, they have every right to abandon the tournament.

On another note - what type of striker will Arsenal sign? Dzeko might fit in quite well with their play style, Carew is out of favour at Villa or will it be Kenwynne Jones who appears to be on the way out (more likely to Birmingham - who have also been linked to Ryan Babel).

[Newton]

I'm not sure. I hope it's Dzeko. I legitimately think that the right striker signing (and possibly central defender) could win Arsenal the league, so we'll have to wait and see.

[grimace06]

Liability (Lucas) Neil saves the day for the Gunners.

[goog]

i like our central deffenders but a third quality one wouldnt hurt

[Newton]

i like our central deffenders but a third quality one wouldnt hurtOh they're great, but they can't realistically be expected to play every game of the season. A quality back up is needed. Djourou is good, but out for the season.

[william h. cosby II]

Liverpool have trimmed some dead wood...

[grimace06]

Liverpool have trimmed some dead wood...

So they sacked Benitez?

[william h. cosby II]

Not yet, but I doubt that's far off.

[autologic]

They got rid of Voronin

[grimace06]

Great win by Man U this morning - Wayne Rooney is an absolute star.

[TimmyJ]

Rooney's looking in intimidating form, atm one of the best in europe.
Pains me to say that because I hate both him and Man U...

[Shaddow]

Chelsea, where ever you maybe,
Don't leave your wife with John Terry,
He can't shoot, He can't pass,
But he'll take your missus up the arse

[TimmyJ]

Liverpool 1-0 Everton this morning.

[Newton]

Poor Aaron Ramsey. He's been flown to London for emergency surgery. His career is in jeopardy. It was a pretty emotional game there, and disturbingly reminiscent of Eduardo's injury at Birmingham.

Surely now it's time for the FA, as well as the British media (good luck here though) to crack down on these kinds of antics? Sure you can say it wasn't a that kind of challenge, but there's no coincidence that in five years Arsenal have had similar injuries to three of their players (Diaby, Eduardo, now Ramsey).

It's a direct result of the "kick them and they won't like it" mentality that the British press, and managers of these lesser teams, encourage when playing against Arsenal.

It was great to see the team bounce back afterwards. Sol was a colossus, and Fabregas was not about to sit in the centre circle William Gallas style. He scored a penalty and set up Vermaelen instead. Great character by the team and it might just kick start a run towards the title, but at the end of the day all thoughts must go towards Aaron Ramsey.

I sincerely hope he can recover from this and that his career remains intact. It would be awful for a nineteen year old kid to be cut down so young when he's clearly so talented, with such a big future in the game ahead of him.

Get well soon Aaron.

[grimace06]

I feel sorry for Ramsey - so talented and modest and breaks his leg only to have his captain celebrate like a yahoo after scoring a penalty which was his only input in the match to that point.

If Cisse can shatter his leg twice and still come back, then I'm confident Ramsey will be back for Arsenal.

[Newton]

Fabregas's celebration was him dedicating the goal to Ramsey, running to the Arsenal fans and saying Aaron and gesturing to his leg. Up until that point he had fed Ramsey who was taken out and denied a clear penalty, provided the assist for Bendtner and dictated quite a few Arsenal attacks. He would then go on to set up Vermaelen for Arsenal's third. He did get man of the match you know. Mad anti-Fabregas agenda.

[grimace06]

Fabregas's celebration was him dedicating the goal to Ramsey, running to the Arsenal fans and saying Aaron and gesturing to his leg. Up until that point he had fed Ramsey who was taken out and denied a clear penalty, provided the assist for Bendtner and dictated quite a few Arsenal attacks. He would then go on to set up Vermaelen for Arsenal's third. He did get man of the match you know. Mad anti-Fabregas agenda.

So what did the shirt over his head have to do with Ramsey?

[Newton]

I think that might've just been him celebrating a goal, which every player is entitled to do - and it's probably more understandable given the emotionally charged nature of the closing stages. How does him putting his shirt over his head make him a yahoo?

Also Stoke fans chanting "You've only got one leg" can **** off. Beyond disgusting.

[Jay]

It was an horrendous injury, and no one likes to see that, but the world against Arsenal conspiracy theories are a bit much. They're not the only side to have players go down with career threatening injuries (Pierluigi Casiraghi devastating knee injury springs immediately to mind from a Chelsea perspective, as well as the head injury to Petr Cech).

[Newton]

Three players in the last four years (I said earlier it was five, but Diaby's was actually in 06) is not a coincidence. It's a result of the 'get at Arsenal and they won't like it' mindset that the British press encourage and they must accept a degree of responsibility. Ricardo Fuller, before the FA Cup game against Arsenal earlier in the season, said that the best way to upset Arsenal is to kick them.

I'm not for one second suggesting that any of the three players who inflicted the injuries went in with the intention to do just that. I'm sure Shawcross is devastated, but if you're encouraging a team to be overly physical against the opposition because they don't like it then you've got to expect that something like this will happen. And it has. Three times.

Also in my opinion three games is not enough for Shawcross and any player that tackles like this. Six at least. If you're driving dangerously and crash into another car and kill someone, you're not going to keep your license or avoid prosecution because you're not that kind of driver. Shawcross flew into that tackle. As did Ramsey. It was fifty fifty, but the way he was swinging his leg was dangerous and went right through Ramsey's shin. It was an accident, but not playing like a lunatic would've helped avoid this injury. Him not being that kind of player does not make it alright.

All the credit in the world to Glen Whelan for staying with Aaron Ramsey from the outset right up until he got on the stretcher, and getting Bendtner in there to talk to him. Classy.

Finally, imagine the uproar if it had been William Gallas going in like that on Wayne Rooney or Steven Gerrard, particularly in a World Cup year.

EDIT:
On Sunday, Arsenal Football Club released the following statement:

“During yesterday’s match against Stoke City, Aaron Ramsey sustained fractures to the tibia and fibula in his right leg. Yesterday evening he underwent surgery.

"The operation successfully reduced the fractures and whilst it is too soon to state an exact timescale for recovery, Aaron will certainly miss the remainder of this season. Our thoughts are with Aaron at this time and everyone at the Club wishes him all the best in making as speedy a return to action as possible.”

The best news we could hope for really.

[TimmyJ]

Also Stoke fans chanting "You've only got one leg" can **** off. Beyond disgusting.

Complete ****ing morons. That is just atrocious.

[william h. cosby II]

Real out of the Champions League.

Cue graceful, honourable reactions in 3, 2, 1.... ;)

[Newton]

Seeya Pellegrini.

Also what a goal by Nasri!

[grimace06]

I think its a disgrace Steven Gerrard escaped punishment for what he did to that Pompey player.

Liverpool will do anything to protect their talisman - who has a variety of off and on field discretions not counting his constant histrionics. Man U have always copped these things on the chin (Cantona, Ferdinand [twice] and Keane) but of course Stevie G gets away with everything.

[Jay]

Go Chelsea! **** yes! Come on!

[grimace06]

A Linesmen hands Chelsea the title.

Brilliant.

[Jay]

Wait, hang on, so Federico's handball goal is acceptable? I agree Drogba was offside, but the result should have been 1 - 0 and you know it.

[grimace06]

Wait, hang on, so Federico's handball goal is acceptable? I agree Drogba was offside, but the result should have been 1 - 0 and you know it.

Jay, that non-offside was a disgrace - how did the linesmen miss that?

At least with the hand ball it was obscured - I honestly thought it came off his chest.

We dominated 2nd half and it should've been 1-1.

[Jay]

Handball is handball, grim. And as much as you may have been the better side in the 2nd half - and you were - you were lucky it wasn't 3 - 0 at half time. So swings and roundabouts.

But yes, the offside non-decision was poor.

[Ad-Rock]

Anyone see Messi's four-goal haul this morning? It was ****ing awesome. His balance is just phenomenal.

[Jay]

So is his bank balance.

I haven't seen the goals yet, looking forward to cathing the highlights tonight.

[Jabbz]

Can't see Inter beating Barca in the semi, especially with the form Messi is in. He totally shredded up Arsenal this morning.

[Jay]

And again...

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=767625&sec=uefachampionsleague&cc=3436

[autologic]

The Inter v Barca tie should be fantastic. If any team this year has looked capable of beating Barcelona it's probably them, their defense was very solid against Chelsea and Sneijder's passing carved them open a number of times. I'd still love to see Barcelona win the thing again this year, if only for the fact that the final is at the Bernabeu. Really rub it in Real Madrid's face :D

[grimace06]

And again...

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=767625&sec=uefachampionsleague&cc=3436

Not tactful, but his comments are mostly correct. Fergie will always speak his mind - why is this shocking to you?

[Jay]

It's not shocking to me - far from it. It's precisely what I expect him to do. I just highlight it because I find his constant whining a disgrace and think it truly demeans his standing in the game.

[Jay]

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=768669&sec=uefachampionsleague&cc=3436

And some more...

[RunningMild]

I heard today that Gold Coast United may be dead after just one season in the A-League.

Not only that, but NQ Fury got 'bailed out' by FFA (whatever that means), Brisbane Roar are in receivership, and other clubs are struggling to attract big enough crowds, sponsors etc. to stay afloat.

Despite all this, Melbourne Heart enter the league this season, with Sydney Rovers coming in next season.

Looks like we have another NSL or NBL on our hands... watch as the A-League grows too fast before imploding due to crippling financial woes.

[grimace06]

Scholesy you are a legend. Over to you, Tottenham.

[Jay]

**** off United and **** off Chelsea. Oh and **** you too grimace. F***!!!!!

[grimace06]

**** off United and **** off Chelsea. Oh and **** you too grimace. F***!!!!!

Easy now Jay - as they say, 2-0 is the hardest lead to defend.

Gareth Bale is a superstar in the making though.

[Jay]

Ha ha yeah. Who will ever forget Iran '97. Anyway, if Chelsea can't win this they don't deserve the ****ing title. Piss weak.

But **** United's ability to pinch late goals. ****s.

[grimace06]

Ha ha yeah. Who will ever forget Iran '97. Anyway, if Chelsea can't win this they don't deserve the ****ing title. Piss weak.

But **** United's ability to pinch late goals. ****s.

Where's ol' Blue with his "Thats what football is about" speeches? :p

[grimace06]

So where are Newton and Cian now that their team has collapsed in heap, despite having the easiest run in of the top 3?

[Newton]

I'm at home at the moment.

The Wigan game was such an embarrassment. But a team missing their whole entire spine is always going to struggle. Shouldn't have been a struggle against Wigan, granted, but for the last month or so Arsenal have been missing Gallas, Arshavin, Cesc, Van Persie, Song and lately Vermaelen. I won't do the whole 'take x player out of x team' because the players left should've been able to hold on to a two goal lead against Wigan. The Spurs result was fair enough. Birmingham was the beginning of the end with that Kevin Phillips face cluster**** of a goal.

Injuries have been the theme of the season, but I don't know how many more years supporters can sit there thinking what could've been. I honestly, honestly believe that had Van Persie (out since November) been fit all season Arsenal would've won the league. I also believe he'd be mentioned in the same breath as the likes of Rooney and that cock who plays for Chelsea. As I said earlier though, people will start to get sick of wondering what could've been. The progress made this season has been heavily undermined by that surrender at Wigan, and to a lesser extent the losses at Spurs and Barca.

Don't be so antagonistic either. No need for it.

EDIT: Cock not picked up by the swear filter? Someone should do something about that.

Also, Wenger's substitutions against Wigan were a joke and basically invited the relegation fighting team to attack. Van Persie should've been given twenty minutes to hold up play and give Wigan a bit more to worry about.

[grimace06]

Liverpool really are a pathetic club. Subtlety not your thing Stevie?

[Emilbus]

Wooot @ Spurs. Here's hoping we leapfrog Arsenal :D

[Jay]

Last day action has begun. Go Blues!!