Audiophiles Unite

[Lazlow]

of which I am not >_>

I'm kick starting this thread to see if there are any decent 2.1 home theatre setups worth looking into.

The way our lounge is 5.1 would be a bitch to set up, and I don't think its particularly necessary. However I've heard there's some 2.1 gear out there that simulates a surround sound environment pretty well.

Any takers? Vicious? >_>

[Fenrir]

NFI, but we seem to have some adept enthusiasts 'round these parts.

The reason I'm posting, though: I go through earphones more quickly than my budget allows, and thus need a durable and/or inexpensively replaceable solution. Audio quality would be a bonus. The problem is in the damned flimsy cords - the inner wire actually snaps, disconnecting the earphones and rendering them useless.

Someone here (possibly Vicious) pointed me in the direction of some high-quality earphones which actually had replaceable cords, which'd probably be the perfect solution (provided the cords are cheap), but I let that info slip away into some unfathomable abyss of forgetfulness.

[Silverwolf]

My friend is an enourmous Audiophile, he's spent over 2k in the last year on his amps and headphones.
The good thing about this is I got his old headphones he was upgrading from for cheap. They're made from wood!!`!1! They are worth about $500 new too, which is awesome.

http://www.aloaudio.com/store/images/ATH-ESW9.jpg
They are really nice, but they do get uncomfortable around my ears after 3+ hours of wearing, since they are so small.

If you mean canalphones/earbuds, Fenrir, only ones i've heard of are the Ultimate Ears UE10's. Quite expensive though.

[Fenrir]

**** me, I'm hearing $900+, and that's on US sites. You're not kidding, eh?

May be able to justify it as a(n aspiring) musician, or something. The big question is, those replaceable cords - are they cheap?

[Silverwolf]

I have no idea myself, my friend said they cost about $600, and I was assuming he meant AU dollars!
Proper headphones have much more options when it comes to replaceable cables.

[Fenrir]

Proper headphones have the disadvantages of being clunky and burdensome.

[Lex]

I go through earphones more quickly than my budget allows, and thus need a durable and/or inexpensively replaceable solution. Audio quality would be a bonus. The problem is in the damned flimsy cords - the inner wire actually snaps, disconnecting the earphones and rendering them useless.

stop buying cheap shit, really.

[Fenrir]

stop buying cheap shit, really.
Where do you set the lower bound on expenditure on earphones, then?

[Shorty]

I've had my Sennheiser HD497s literally for years thanks to the detachable headphone cable. If that goes, I order another one for a few dollars and it's good as new.

[incompatible with life]

The reason I'm posting, though: I go through earphones more quickly than my budget allows, and thus need a durable and/or inexpensively replaceable solution. Audio quality would be a bonus. The problem is in the damned flimsy cords - the inner wire actually snaps, disconnecting the earphones and rendering them useless.
Depending on what you're listening with, maybe try some bluetooth headphones?
I have seen a few bluetooth adapters for standard audio plugs.
Admittedly as long as I can hear the music I'm not too fussed about quality but I haven't had too many problems (aside from the occasional connection issue).

[Fenrir]

I'm no audiophile (and therefore probably have no place in this thread), so sound quality is almost a non-issue - but I really prefer earphones.

[incompatible with life]

Something like this? (http://www.catchoftheday.com.au/Philips_SwitchStream_BlueTooth_Headsets!-p-671.html)

Or this? (http://direct.motorola.com/hellomoto/s9/)

[Vicious]

of which I am not >_>

I'm kick starting this thread to see if there are any decent 2.1 home theatre setups worth looking into.

The way our lounge is 5.1 would be a bitch to set up, and I don't think its particularly necessary. However I've heard there's some 2.1 gear out there that simulates a surround sound environment pretty well.

Any takers? Vicious? >_>

The best bet if you're trying ti simulate would be a sound bar. The problem I have with those is they very much depend on the room and placement. Headphones can simulate 5.0 very well thanks to Dolby Headphone and the fact that there's no outside acoustics to compensate for.

There's tons of questions to ask though in regards to what you want:

1) Are you powering these with a HT receiver, stereo receiver, or a true amp, preamp, etc.?

2) Do you prefer bookshelves or floorstanding?

3) Can you take pics of the room, make a diagram, or describe the seating situation?

4) Are people spread all over the place when viewing movies, or generally centered (chair placed in random places vs. everyone sitting on a sofa)?

5) Budget ;)

I already have something in mind that is fairly reasonable . . . but I need to confirm your needs first.

Someone here (possibly Vicious) pointed me in the direction of some high-quality earphones which actually had replaceable cords, which'd probably be the perfect solution (provided the cords are cheap), but I let that info slip away into some unfathomable abyss of forgetfulness.

Those were Ultimate Ears Super.Fi 3, 5 Pro, or Triple.fi. They are no longer made, presumably due to the Logitech acquisition of UE. I'm personally not amused that they got rid of detachable cables :mad:

I know a guy on another forum that's also in Australia. I suggested Denon AH-C351K IEMs to him which he grabbed off ebay. He's been enjoying them quite a bit from what I understand.

He ended up grabbing them from here (http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Denon-AH-C351-Black-In-Ear-Earphones-Headphones-AHC351K_W0QQitemZ370208393915QQcmdZViewItemQQptZOt her_MP3_Player_Accessories?hash=item563223cabb&_trksid=p3286.m63.l1177&_trkparms=240%3A1318|301%3A1|293%3A1|294%3A50)

Should be a solid deal.

EDIT:

Did a bit of research, and it turns out the Altec Lansing UHP336 is a rebranded Super.Fi 3 that still has the detachable cable. ;)

I have no idea myself, my friend said they cost about $600, and I was assuming he meant AU dollars!
Proper headphones have much more options when it comes to replaceable cables.

Their MSRP is actually $280 (USD) in Japan. The real cost is importing and artificial inflation from temporary demand. Headroom used to charge $550 for them and is now trying to clear them out for $300 USD due to some dislike of the sound signature (too much bass). Hell, Amazon/Beach Camera (distro) dropped them to $230.

Personally I dislike wood in headphones . . . causes much more of a headache than it's ever worth, even if it does look sexy as all get out.

[Lazlow]

The best bet if you're trying ti simulate would be a sound bar. The problem I have with those is they very much depend on the room and placement. Headphones can simulate 5.0 very well thanks to Dolby Headphone and the fact that there's no outside acoustics to compensate for.

There's tons of questions to ask though in regards to what you want:

1) Are you powering these with a HT receiver, stereo receiver, or a true amp, preamp, etc.?

We've got nothing atm... hoping there's a All-in-1 solution.

2) Do you prefer bookshelves or floorstanding?

Got space for either/or so no real preference

3) Can you take pics of the room, make a diagram, or describe the seating situation?

Crude Paint pic ahoy

http://i29.tinypic.com/300tizb.jpg

About 5-6m square. Arrows indicate is an open walkway, south leads through an arch to the kitchen/dining area, north heads to front door/main bedroom area. black scribbled areas at the walls, blue is a window.

4) Are people spread all over the place when viewing movies, or generally centered (chair placed in random places vs. everyone sitting on a sofa)?

Usually on the couch

5) Budget

Haven't really set one as I have no idea what I'm looking at for what I'm after. That said, over $1000 would probably be pushing it.

[Vicious]

Lazlow,

This may be a bit tight, and you're going to want to call the online distro I mention to see what discounts you can get as they offer lower than RRP (the speakers I link are already on clearance it seems). The good news is they're located in Australia so no importing, etc.

Cambridge 340A Integrated (http://clefhifi.com.au/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=34&products_id=498)

Wharfedale D9.1 (http://clefhifi.com.au/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=25_28&products_id=163)

You'll want to ask them about what sub you can match with these for $1000 or so (it may be a bit over, but the SQ will be solid on many levels). Otherwise

Brands they carry that I'd try to get with the setup include:

Jamo, B&W, Velodyne, Wharfedale, and Boston Acoustics. Anything else probably isn't worth it or more expensive than you can afford considering the squeeze already.

If you just can't pull off the sub then you may want to do a slight upgrade on the speakers till you can afford one or decide you need one. The D9.2 (http://clefhifi.com.au/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=25_28&products_id=164) are only $100 more and offer a bit more extension into the bass.


I was originally going to suggest importing a set of Mirage bookshelves and buying the amp and sub there, but on 1000 AUD importing is pretty much out of the question.

As for an all in one solution a soundbar would fail hopelessly in that scenario. You'd lose left surround simulation extremely fast.

[Fenrir]

Those were Ultimate Ears Super.Fi 3, 5 Pro, or Triple.fi. They are no longer made, presumably due to the Logitech acquisition of UE. I'm personally not amused that they got rid of detachable cables :mad:

I know a guy on another forum that's also in Australia. I suggested Denon AH-C351K IEMs to him which he grabbed off ebay. He's been enjoying them quite a bit from what I understand.

He ended up grabbing them from here (http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Denon-AH-C351-Black-In-Ear-Earphones-Headphones-AHC351K_W0QQitemZ370208393915QQcmdZViewItemQQptZOt her_MP3_Player_Accessories?hash=item563223cabb&_trksid=p3286.m63.l1177&_trkparms=240%3A1318|301%3A1|293%3A1|294%3A50)

Should be a solid deal.

EDIT:

Did a bit of research, and it turns out the Altec Lansing UHP336 is a rebranded Super.Fi 3 that still has the detachable cable. ;)
Bumping to remind myself to buy. :cool:

[Blue]

I need some headphones.

I want either supra-aural, or simply portable. My friend has a pair of supra-aural Sennheisers with cups (as opposed to the foam pads) that are very comfortable, and I think I prefer the feel and look of those rather than the foam pad idea. I haven't actually listened to them, though. They do have a detachable cable, which is nice.

So, I'm looking for something portable, preferably with a collapsible band like these things have. I'm not interested in noise reduction. Any recommendations?

[Fenrir]

Update, I'm horrified (http://www.headphones.com.au/pbrowse?search=ultimate+cable).

That's more than I pay for entire replacement earphones, just on replacement cables for the damn things (http://headphones.com.au/psingle?productID=248). Unless they're frickin' hyperdurable cables from the future, I need a new strategy.

What do you guys make of v-moda (http://www.v-moda.com/)? The reviews and promotional media go on about durability, and the Amazon price points seem (http://www.amazon.com/V-Moda-Vibe-Earbuds-Gunmetal-Black/dp/B000V5L5MG/ref=dp_cp_ob_e_title_0) fairly (http://www.amazon.com/V-Moda-Earbuds-Headset-iPhone-Compatible/dp/B001132DNW/ref=pd_cp_e_3) reasonable (http://www.amazon.com/V-Moda-Earbud-Headset-Microphone-Compatible/dp/B001NABXXE/ref=pd_cp_e_3) - however there are some ominous warnings buried in the (http://www.amazon.com/review/R2DIYQES2YOCSO/ref=cm_cr_rdp_perm) comments (http://www.amazon.com/review/R3NX3P8C9XLNBY/ref=cm_cr_rdp_perm). The sort of shit that's going wrong with all of the earphones I buy, but at least they seem to abide their warranty terms. >_>

[Vicious]

I need some headphones.

I want either supra-aural, or simply portable. My friend has a pair of supra-aural Sennheisers with cups (as opposed to the foam pads) that are very comfortable, and I think I prefer the feel and look of those rather than the foam pad idea. I haven't actually listened to them, though. They do have a detachable cable, which is nice.

So, I'm looking for something portable, preferably with a collapsible band like these things have. I'm not interested in noise reduction. Any recommendations?

If you're not worried about isolation at all, but are on a budget and looking for a pair of throw arounds the Koss Porta Pro is always a personal favorite. Cheap, lifetime warranty, and a great starter can for a lot of people.

Update, I'm horrified (http://www.headphones.com.au/pbrowse?search=ultimate+cable).

That's more than I pay for entire replacement earphones, just on replacement cables for the damn things (http://headphones.com.au/psingle?productID=248). Unless they're frickin' hyperdurable cables from the future, I need a new strategy.

Then just buy them because they're good IEMs. Or buy the new Altec Lansing Backbeat Pro as I believe they're based off the Super.Fi 4 (super.fi 3 inside smaller IEM without removable cable).

Personally if Altec Lansing sells the UHP336 over there and the cable breaks you could probably just RMA it with them since they have a two year warranty without exclusions AFAIK.

What do you guys make of v-moda (http://www.v-moda.com/)? The reviews and promotional media go on about durability, and the Amazon price points seem (http://www.amazon.com/V-Moda-Vibe-Earbuds-Gunmetal-Black/dp/B000V5L5MG/ref=dp_cp_ob_e_title_0) fairly (http://www.amazon.com/V-Moda-Earbuds-Headset-iPhone-Compatible/dp/B001132DNW/ref=pd_cp_e_3) reasonable (http://www.amazon.com/V-Moda-Earbud-Headset-Microphone-Compatible/dp/B001NABXXE/ref=pd_cp_e_3) - however there are some ominous warnings buried in the (http://www.amazon.com/review/R2DIYQES2YOCSO/ref=cm_cr_rdp_perm) comments (http://www.amazon.com/review/R3NX3P8C9XLNBY/ref=cm_cr_rdp_perm). The sort of shit that's going wrong with all of the earphones I buy, but at least they seem to abide their warranty terms. >_>

They are bass heavy and made mostly for dance music with a smiley face frequency response. I consider them audio jewelry for the club scene honestly.

You could always take a look at entry level IEMs from Shure, Etymotic, Westone, Klipsch, Audeo PFE's are also nice . . . though the price varies quite a bit depending on what you want . . .

No matter what IEM you get make sure you budget for comply foam tips on occasion. Bass from IEMs depends on seal entirely, and the only way to guarantee that is with a foam that seals well. Not to mention they help noise isolation by plenty.

In other news I just bought a pair of these:

http://www.headphone.com/productphotos/large/0020420701_1763.jpg

Audio Technica AD700

For use when I'm in bed. They're a really easy load so my Zune should drive them without problem, and they're midrange centric so I don't have to deal with shrilling highs or start bouncing my head to bass. I tried some JVC flats for the purpose but they were too shrill with a Grado like peak at the top end >_<

[drzaius]

I just set up my first serious Hi-Fi:

Naim CD (CD3), pre (NAC82) and power (NAP180)
Project Rpm 6 with ortofon 2m black cartridge.
Dynavector p75 phono stage
Neat motive 2 speakers.
All wired with naim cable and interconnects.

Next is a sonos (on it's way) + dacmagic for streaming.

it sounds awesome.

[Vicious]

All wired with naim cable and interconnects.

Please tell me you didn't waste money on overpriced interconnects . . . everything else in the system looks good though.

[Fenrir]

Then just buy them because they're good IEMs. Or buy the new Altec Lansing Backbeat Pro as I believe they're based off the Super.Fi 4 (super.fi 3 inside smaller IEM without removable cable).

Personally if Altec Lansing sells the UHP336 over there and the cable breaks you could probably just RMA it with them since they have a two year warranty without exclusions AFAIK.
Are they at all likely to try to weasel out of warranty obligations off the back of user neglect/abuse, et al?

My situation is that I'm sick of going through earphones like light bulbs - so you can understand if I express concern over higher-quality earphones just becoming more expensive light bulbs. Better quality sound would be a nice bonus, but if the possibility of them breaking within my "active lifestyle" (which has lately become more active) and leaving me out-of-pocket by some hefty sum of cash arises, then I'm not interested.

I guess the $50 spare cable cost camouflages well against the price tag of the earphones themselves, though. If the cables can take a beating, and if cable warranty is available, then maybe.

They are bass heavy and made mostly for dance music with a smiley face frequency response. I consider them audio jewelry for the club scene honestly.
Hmm, fair enough. I only showed interest because they went on about space-age metallic cables of the future. >_>

[StorminNorman]

If it makes you feel any better, Fenrir, the first pair of headphones I had that lasted me more than two years was also the first pair I paid over $100 for (Sennheiser PX200s). I recently upgraded to a pair of Senn HD228s, although I've just discovered that there's going to be an updated version of the PX200 soon as well.

I can't really stand earphones/IEMs, so I tend to go with headphones, though.

Actually, Vicious, here's a question you can probably answer: What are the real differences between "open" and "closed" headphones? I keep hearing stuff about resonances and other nerdy audiophile bullshit, but I want to know, in actual language that people understand, what the actual differences are.

All I know is that "open" headphones usually cost about $50 more than "closed" ones.

[Vicious]

Are they at all likely to try to weasel out of warranty obligations off the back of user neglect/abuse, et al?

They haven't for me . . . currently I'm in the process of an RMA because my right armature died. They didn't have a problem or even ask if anything happened. I imagine at this point they would probably just send you a replacement cable if it broke going through Altec Lansing . . . or would sell it at a much cheaper price than the UE cables.

My situation is that I'm sick of going through earphones like light bulbs - so you can understand if I express concern over higher-quality earphones just becoming more expensive light bulbs. Better quality sound would be a nice bonus, but if the possibility of them breaking within my "active lifestyle" (which has lately become more active) and leaving me out-of-pocket by some hefty sum of cash arises, then I'm not interested.

You're taking the right step wanting to buy a better IEM then with a two or three year warranty. Most premium companies tend to stand behind their IEMs very well . . . though I'd avoid UE (directly) since they've been taken over by Logitech and had warranties greatly reduced while ****ing over resellers.

/not a fan of Logitech besides remotes/

I guess the $50 spare cable cost camouflages well against the price tag of the earphones themselves, though. If the cables can take a beating, and if cable warranty is available, then maybe.

Maybe just call your Altec Lansing distributor and say you're interested in purchasing earphones but want to know if they warranty the cable? They should probably tell you yay/nay.

Hmm, fair enough. I only showed interest because they went on about space-age metallic cables of the future. >_>

I laugh at cable marketing . . . and also cry when I realize some people legitimately spend thousands on cables . . .

I can't really stand earphones/IEMs, so I tend to go with headphones, though.

They definitely take getting used to . . . did you try some foam tips with IEMs before? Maybe some small comply tips would have worked well for you . . .

Actually, Vicious, here's a question you can probably answer: What are the real differences between "open" and "closed" headphones? I keep hearing stuff about resonances and other nerdy audiophile bullshit, but I want to know, in actual language that people understand, what the actual differences are.

All I know is that "open" headphones usually cost about $50 more than "closed" ones.

Open means the driver enclosure is just that . . . open in the back. This allows more air to be moved and to reduce backwaves (sound bouncing back at the driver). However, you can hear other people through the headphones and they can also hear your music (which may piss a lot of people off).

Closed means the driver enclosure is sealed in the back. This means it offers noise isolation, but has other compromises like requiring dampening and backwaves.

Closed cans in the same pricing bracket as open will tend to have more distortion and a less impressive frequency response. They can also get warmer on the ears.

*comment on distortion: I question how much this will really impact most people. Most headphones have less than 1% distortion . . . most cone based (dynamic) speakers have 10% distortion anyway. Food for thought! :D

Generally speaking you're going to have to spend more on a closed can over an open can to get similar performance or accept you are going to get less actual performance (which may even happen with a more expensive closed can anyway). For outside usage I usually recommend a closed headphone or an IEM (armature based IEMs are capable of better performance with isolation BTW). For home usage having an open headphone with a quiet room usually can't be beat in terms of price to performance.

Lastly:

Comment on performance. I consider performance an objective and not subjective criteria in audio. A flat frequency response, low distortion, and proper transient reproduction is what I mean in terms of performance. What's objectively best for reproduction. If you like more treble/midrange/bass then a closed phone may end up performing better or cheaper with a subjective ideal or if isolation becomes a performance criterion. I tend not to buy for subjective but for the purpose I need filled.




Hope that clears some things up, and if you have anymore questions I'll be glad to help. Hopefully I didn't get too convoluted with my explanation, but there are some key terms like backwaves that really need to be understood to know why closed phones are generally considered a compromise.

[Blue]

If you're not worried about isolation at all, but are on a budget and looking for a pair of throw arounds the Koss Porta Pro is always a personal favorite. Cheap, lifetime warranty, and a great starter can for a lot of people.They do look ugly as ****, however. Sennheiser PX100 get any sort of recommendation from you?

[Vicious]

They do look ugly as ****, however. Sennheiser PX100 get any sort of recommendation from you?

Bah, you just don't know style :p

The PX100 and Porta Pro are almost identical in FR and other areas. Both are quite bass heavy honestly. If you must the PX100 would suffice . . . but when the Porta Pro is cheaper and has a longer warranty it gets my vote.

Anyway, I imagine either would work for you. Also consider looking at the 25th anniversary Porta Pro if you're worried about aesthetics before going with the PX100. Just a consideration.

[Fenrir]

Maybe just call your Altec Lansing distributor and say you're interested in purchasing earphones but want to know if they warranty the cable? They should probably tell you yay/nay.
Alright, I'll do this when payday comes around, thanks.

I laugh at cable marketing . . . and also cry when I realize some people legitimately spend thousands on cables . . .
Oh, it wasn't that Monster-cable sound quality marketing crap - at least, not from memory. They just stated/implied durability.


>_>
<_<
>_>

[StorminNorman]

Thanks for the reply, Vicious. That's the clearest I've ever seen it explained.

As for IEMs/earphones, the problem is that they tend to actually irritate my ears. I've had soreness last for a couple of days after wearing (admittedly cheap) earphones.

Also I just think they look kind of dorky.

[Vicious]

Thanks for the reply, Vicious. That's the clearest I've ever seen it explained.

That's good. I was doing my best to make it as straightforward as possible.

As for IEMs/earphones, the problem is that they tend to actually irritate my ears. I've had soreness last for a couple of days after wearing (admittedly cheap) earphones.

Do you know which ones they were . . . and were they using silicon tips?

Worse that happens to me is my ears can get a bit dry and itchy.

Also I just think they look kind of dorky.

Definitely depends on which ones you get. The Super.Fi 3, 5 Pro/EB, and Triple.Fi definitely look like Frankenstein bolts for the ears. None the less I have yet to find a better bang for the buck than the Super.Fi 3 (UHP336 rebadge). I imagine the Super.Fi 4 rebadge might be up your alley though . . .

[drzaius]

Please tell me you didn't waste money on overpriced interconnects . . . everything else in the system looks good though.

oh they were overpriced for sure.
But after paying for everything else in the setup it seemed pretty mild.

naim enthusiasts are mad for their cable apparently. The instruction manuals are hilariously overenthusiastic. not only do they DEMAND that you use the right cables (directional of course! and at least 3.5 metres each way for the speaker cable) but they warn that ANY other speakers in your room will negatively alter the acoustics... even the speakers in your telephone headset! Also they suggest that all the equipment be left on for about five days before it starts sounding its best.

anyway, it all looks kickass. I'll post a picture once i get the streaming bits and bobs in place.

[Blue]

Bah, you just don't know style :p

The PX100 and Porta Pro are almost identical in FR and other areas. Both are quite bass heavy honestly. If you must the PX100 would suffice . . . but when the Porta Pro is cheaper and has a longer warranty it gets my vote.

Anyway, I imagine either would work for you. Also consider looking at the 25th anniversary Porta Pro if you're worried about aesthetics before going with the PX100. Just a consideration.http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m198/xdvdx/KOSS%20PortaPro%2025th%20Anniversary%20Edition/portaCompare.jpg

Much better! :p

Seriously, these things are hideous. I think I'll just go for the PX100s, but thanks for the help anyway. I'm not fussed about the apparent bass-heaviness, really. After using IEMs for my entire portable life, I'm hanging out for a bit more bass. ;)

[Vicious]

oh they were overpriced for sure.
But after paying for everything else in the setup it seemed pretty mild.

naim enthusiasts are mad for their cable apparently. The instruction manuals are hilariously overenthusiastic. not only do they DEMAND that you use the right cables (directional of course! and at least 3.5 metres each way for the speaker cable) but they warn that ANY other speakers in your room will negatively alter the acoustics... even the speakers in your telephone headset! Also they suggest that all the equipment be left on for about five days before it starts sounding its best.

anyway, it all looks kickass. I'll post a picture once i get the streaming bits and bobs in place.

As long as you don't start to believe it then it's all good. The second you go to head-fi and start looking at thousand dollar cables is the day you need to get out of audio entirely ;)

PS:

There's no such thing as a directional interconnect :p

Much better!

Seriously, these things are hideous. I think I'll just go for the PX100s, but thanks for the help anyway. I'm not fussed about the apparent bass-heaviness, really. After using IEMs for my entire portable life, I'm hanging out for a bit more bass.

No love for the retro . . . it's a shame :(

PS:

Getting rid of the tacky blue does make a large difference . . . one looks retro and the other looks retro AND odd. Just my thoughts.

PPS:

They also still look better than skull candies.

//end

[Blue]

I've looked at images of the PX100s, and most of them seem to look like this:

http://hifi-reviews.com/images/headphones/sennheiserPX100_01.jpg

But I've just found these:

http://media.audiojunkies.com/sennheiser-px-100-ii-headphones.jpg

'PX100 II', apparently. I might try to find a pair of these, because they look better than the silver racing-wheel look of the originals.

[StorminNorman]

Yep. Sennheiser just recently released successors to the PX100/200 line. Apparently they're even better than the original models, which is a good thing, as the PX100 is considered ridiculously good value for money.

Vicious: The other problem with IEMs is that I can't use them as a headband to hold my hair back. :p

[drzaius]

PS:

There's no such thing as a directional interconnect :p


honestly, it's like alternative medicine or religion.
people just believe things.

[Vicious]

honestly, it's like alternative medicine or religion.
people just believe things.

That's the best way of describing it.

In other news, the AD700's came in a while ago:

http://lh5.ggpht.com/_qQq7IsRuilM/Su-zbWwQr9I/AAAAAAAAA2U/ly_kofkN05s/s720/P1030190.JPG

I must say, they are the perfect bed headphone. Nice rolled of bass, trebles exist but aren't shrill, the angled drives help make them sound a bit distant, they are easy to drive, and best of all they're comfortable.

Definitely not a reference phone like my AKGs, but definitely dignified for what they are.

[Blue]

I grabbed a pair of the PX100s today. They didn't have the new version, and the bird at JB obviously had no ****ing clue about anything, just pulled out the "latest Sennheiser catalogue" and asked me if I meant the PX150s, so I grabbed the older ones.

I thought I heard a little bit of treble distortion when I was first trying them out, but listening to different songs now, I've not heard it again. Bass-heavy, definitely, but not muddy. I'm loving the idea of having some collapsible headphones that are comfortable and don't fall out of my ears like canalphones can tend to do. Bit of bass is nice for such small phones, nice to be able to hear bass lines properly without having to shove a canalphone into my brain to get the right seal. That's why I didn't get the PX200s, I hate having to get a seal rather than the most comfortable position.

Anyway, pretty happy for the price. :)

[igotnewsuper8systemWRONG!]

I ordered my first pair of expensive (to non audiophiles) headphones after some hefty forum reading, Alessadro MS1i's. Should be here next week.

[Vicious]

I ordered my first pair of expensive (to non audiophiles) headphones after some hefty forum reading, Alessadro MS1i's. Should be here next week.

Tell your ears I'm sorry :(

I used to not mind the Grado/Alessandro sound, but after listening to some reference cans I realize just how shrill they are. >_<'

Either way I hope you like them.

[igotnewsuper8systemWRONG!]

I'll make a note to stay away from reference cans. I got them from headphones.com.au, so if I don't like them atleast I can send them back and get something else.

[Vicious]

I'll make a note to stay away from reference cans. I got them from headphones.com.au, so if I don't like them atleast I can send them back and get something else.

Yes, stay away from reference speakers too. They honestly will ruin your life ;)

I hope you like whatever you decide on. Some people love the peaky treble sound.

[igotnewsuper8systemWRONG!]

I've been lurking around Head-Fi and I'm really hoping I can turn them into MS-1000's. Do you know anything about this? Have any tips?

[Vicious]

I've been lurking around Head-Fi and I'm really hoping I can turn them into MS-1000's. Do you know anything about this? Have any tips?

Honestly I'm not a big Grado or Alessandro fan anymore so I really don't keep up with that stuff.

Generally speaking I'd avoid some of the "tweaks" some head-fiers come up with . . . they can be a bit ludicrous sometimes. People here think I'm an eccentric, but I'm reserved in comparison to many there.

Looking at the mod though I already have a feeling I see what's going on. It's probably going to change the rate at which SLP builds to create "impact" . . . much like many Grado's (etc) do already.

This is very much a damned if you do damned if you don't case with headphone design. Having a constant SPL with a linear response makes your headphone sound like it has no impact even if it has bass. On the other hand a headphone without bass can sound like it has impact if SPL doesn't build at a constant pressure and isn't necessarily linear.

For this reason I'm not really a fan of the liberator, and inherently anything that builds off of it. Headphones aren't going to have impact unless they're doing something empirically wrong.

[Lazlow]

So had a look through my local JB HiFi's stock, and spotted these 3 bookshelf speakers in my price range;

Wharfedale AT200 - $322
Wharfedale XARUS 1000 - $298
Dali Concept 1 - $333

Thoughts? Comments? Opinions?

[Vicious]

The Wharfedale AT200 would probably be the best of those. I believe the XARUS is mostly made for mixing/monitoring duty, and Dali is pretty ho-hum in the entry line.

EDIT:

On the other hand you could get the Diamond 9.1 cheaper here (http://clefhifi.com.au/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=25_28&products_id=163).

[igotnewsuper8systemWRONG!]

Alright so after a couple of weeks of listening I am really loving these MS1's. They are an absolute joy to listen to, be it from my laptop, guitar pedal, tv or walkman. Most importantly, its been a while since I have enjoyed music so much. Really happy with my purchase, would definitely recommend to any other audio scrubs out there.

[Pai Mel]

My powered monitor speakers sound fuzzy when you just turn them on and need to warm up playing loud material for a couple of minutes before they will sound clean again. Is that a sign of the power capacitors getting old or the transistors? How much would it cost approx. to get them refurbished?

[Vicious]

My powered monitor speakers sound fuzzy when you just turn them on and need to warm up playing loud material for a couple of minutes before they will sound clean again. Is that a sign of the power capacitors getting old or the transistors? How much would it cost approx. to get them refurbished?

I imagine it would be a leaky capacitor. You'll have to contact the manufacture to see how much it would cost for them to repair it probably.

[StorminNorman]

I've got a Logitech iPod alarm clock with the same problem. I'd replace it under warranty, but it's an excuse to buy a better one in the next year.

[Pai Mel]

I can't do the warranty thing as I've had it for 8 years at least. Each monitor speaker weighs about 35 kg. There is a 250W amp for the woofer and a 100W amp for the tweeter built in. So if I can fix it myself I'd rather that. Otherwise, it's no pain to warm up the speakers before use and just persevere with the initial fuzziness.

[Vicious]

I can't do the warranty thing as I've had it for 8 years at least. Each monitor speaker weighs about 35 kg. There is a 250W amp for the woofer and a 100W amp for the tweeter built in. So if I can fix it myself I'd rather that. Otherwise, it's no pain to warm up the speakers before use and just persevere with the initial fuzziness.

Pai,

I can try and help you troubleshoot this if you're really interested; there's still a chance it could be a transistor or something else entirely. You'll need to post a pic on here in decent quality and at a high enough resolution though -- maybe host it at a file dump so we don't have to deal with resizing. Probably wouldn't hurt to check for DC offset either as it could be a bias issue that fixes itself as it heats up.

You'll need a soldering iron (preferably heat adjustable since you'll probably end up working with lead free solder) if we find the problem, a multimeter is a staple, and know how to read a schematic or follow the circuit.

If it's a leaky cap there's a chance it may show a bulge or other anomalies. That's only if we're really lucky though. Amps can be simple or complex to work on depending on our luck, so I really can't advise you till we see the board.

PS:

As a heads up I'm only good at guiding you through testing and troubleshooting the basics, so if the problem turns out to be more complex I'd suggest going to diyaudio (http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/solid-state/), however they usually expect you've at least checked the basics before asking in my experience.

[Pai Mel]

Got soldering iron and still have a roll of solder that is not lead-free.

Might have to add a multimeter on my Christmas list.

I've built simple electronics kits before, most complicated being a variable power supply, so I can follow schematics. I don't really understand how most things work though - even if I had completed an Electrical Technology course in TAFE, it was all over my head. Only did the course cause I didn't know what else to do.

I'm still a bit nervous about pulling the speaker apart and I want to listen to some music these next couple of weeks.

How about you help me with something simpler first, like fixing a component tape deck that has one capstan motor that doesn't spin?

[Dr Skinnybones]

wanting some help on headphones.

getting some 'phones for my sisters 21st. she is after good headphones for the activity of sitting and listening to music, so they wouldn't need to be portable. I'm thinking open, budget is $100-200.

i doubt they would ever be used with high quality hifi equipment. her primary music source is her macbook but she wants to get a vinyl player at some point but I expect this would be entry level. what would be the best bang for my buck?

[Vicious]

wanting some help on headphones.

getting some 'phones for my sisters 21st. she is after good headphones for the activity of sitting and listening to music, so they wouldn't need to be portable. I'm thinking open, budget is $100-200.

i doubt they would ever be used with high quality hifi equipment. her primary music source is her macbook but she wants to get a vinyl player at some point but I expect this would be entry level. what would be the best bang for my buck?

Probably the AT ATH-AD700 (http://headphones.com.au/psingle?productID=178) or similar. Extremely comfortable, easy to power, and easy to listen to.

[drzaius]

if anyone spots a 2nd hand naim headline on their travels, please let me know.

[Vicious]

if anyone spots a 2nd hand naim headline on their travels, please let me know.

I'll keep an eye open on sites I frequent, but judging by a quick search you're probably best looking for a different make/model as it seems hard finding one used at a reasonable price.

There's two listed on Ebay (http://shop.ebay.com/?_from=R40&_trksid=p3907.m38.l1313&_nkw=Naim+headline&_sacat=See-All-Categories) though if you're willing to throw a lot of money at it (requires importing and possible rewiring of the PSU they're using).

BTW,

What headphones are you planning on using with it? :)

[adam_91vn]

Spend some money on my ears today :D (all from headphonics)

Got a pair of Audio Technica: ATH-AD700

http://gobigelectronics.com/images/products/ath-ad700.jpg
http://www.headphonethings.co.uk/images/AT-ATH-AD700.jpg

The Corda Swing to help run them and fix my sound issue with the tv that has the 360

http://www.meier-audio.homepage.t-online.de/bilder/swingblackright480.jpg

And these for the wife, Sennheiser cx300-II

http://www.grahams.co.uk/shop/media/gbu0/prodsm/sennheiser-cx300-II-black-500x500.jpg

$667 all up :(

[Vicious]

You should enjoy the AD700s . . . they aren't the most accurate, but they're good for the price and sooo comfy!

As for the Swing amp, please tell me you're using the xfeed on it :o


I got some new IEMs for exercising . . . the JVCs I were using got on my nerves, suck with silicon tips, but with foam get bacteria and gave me an ear infection which ruptured a damn eardrum (FFFFUUUUU)

So yeah, MEElectronics M6:

http://www.meelec.com/v/vspfiles/photos/Earphone-M6-MEE-3T.jpg

They sound great for the cash.

[TAT]

Are the Koss Porta Pro's any good for headphones <$150?

[Vicious]

Are the Koss Porta Pro's any good for headphones <$150?

They're considered one of the best bang for the bucks. They have low distortion even though they aren't the most accurate, and their lifetime warranty has stood the test of time.

Know though that they're extremely open . . . so there's no noise isolation (people can hear you, you can hear them).

Depending on usage you may also consider the Audio Technica ATH-AD 3, 4, or 500 (if say you're using it with a computer at home). There's also the Allesandro MS-1 . . . but I'm not a huge fan of the sound by any means.

If you need a closed headphone I can suggest a few too. Just let me know.

[TAT]

They're considered one of the best bang for the bucks. They have low distortion even though they aren't the most accurate, and their lifetime warranty has stood the test of time.

Know though that they're extremely open . . . so there's no noise isolation (people can hear you, you can hear them).
Good to know. They're mainly for personal use, so the open/closed isn't really an issue.

Thanks for the info.

[adam_91vn]

You should enjoy the AD700s . . . they aren't the most accurate, but they're good for the price and sooo comfy!

As for the Swing amp, please tell me you're using the xfeed on it :o


I mainly using it for the 360 atm. I thought crossfeed should only be used for stuff that has a high stereo presence like music created in the 50's or something.

[Vicious]

I mainly using it for the 360 atm. I thought crossfeed should only be used for stuff that has a high stereo presence like music created in the 50's or something.

Well, I'd use it for any music because none of it is really mastered for headphones.

As for the 360 . . . not sure how much of it should be used with it if at all . . .

[Lazlow]

Would I be wasting money on either of these two stereo amps?

Pioneer A-109 (http://www.pioneer.com.au/Products/Home%20Entertainment/Home%20Components%20and%20Accessories/A109.aspx) - $398 @ JB HiFi

Sherwood RX-4109 (http://www.sherwoodusa.com/prod_rx4109.html) - $295 @ JB HiFi

[Pai Mel]

Why buy stereo in our age of surround sound, unless you plan on using them to amplify a pair of speakers in a surround setup.

Imo, there are better bang for your buck, specially factory-seconds or refurbished units.

http://www.excelhifi.com.au/

https://web1.pioneer.com.au/itf/PHX/phoenix.nsf/Index

[Vicious]

Would I be wasting money on either of these two stereo amps?

Pioneer A-109 (http://www.pioneer.com.au/Products/Home%20Entertainment/Home%20Components%20and%20Accessories/A109.aspx) - $398 @ JB HiFi

Sherwood RX-4109 (http://www.sherwoodusa.com/prod_rx4109.html) - $295 @ JB HiFi

I tend not to trust amps that don't specify a 4ohm load.

I'd suggest calling clef hifi about this ([url=http://clefhifi.com.au/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=34&products_id=498) Cambridge and see what sort of deal you can work out.

What speakers are you trying to power BTW?

EDIT:

@Pai Mel

Amp sections tend to suck on HT Receivers. So if one is planning on using it for music or stereo an integrated is a good way to get started at a halfway reasonable price.

[Lazlow]

Heh, I think that's the second time you've linked to that Cambridge amp. Might just tell the olds to get me something else for my b'day, and just bite the bullet on that amp.

[TAT]

The advantage, if you'd call it that, of living close to a post office is that you get the first deliveries of the day.

The Porta Pros are here, and are surprisingly smaller than I was expecting.

I'll take a photo a bit later and give my impressions of the sound quality.

The lifetime warranty is a definite plus.

[Vicious]

Heh, I think that's the second time you've linked to that Cambridge amp. Might just tell the olds to get me something else for my b'day, and just bite the bullet on that amp.

Second time in this thread yes. Since I'm not in Australia it's hard for me to track down the best offerings for the price over there, but this one seems to definitely stand out if you can get a good enough discount.

I'll take a photo a bit later and give my impressions of the sound quality.

Please do :)

[TAT]

Please do :)
So I sign for my parcel, bring it inside and even though the box is about half the size of a desktop pc, it's extremely light. Opening the package reveals that the sealed headphones take up barely half the space - the rest is made up of pieces of foam. The headphones themselves look almost diminutive compared to the plantronics mic/headset I use with the pc (pics to follow; can't upload from work or my phone, frustratingly). In the headphone packaging are the porta pros, a soft synthetic carry case and a (gold plated?) 3.5mm-6.35mm connector. It's a very slick package for what are a fairly inexpensive pair of headphones.

Like I've already said I was most taken aback by the size of the unit, and you'll see from the photos that they don't even cover my ears (which are tiny for an adult). The band is a thin metal strip and my only complaint thusfar is that my hair sometimes gets caught in it :P. There is a generous layer of foam over the speakers and another strip of foam a cm or two above, to transfer some pressure from the ears to the head. They are extremely comfortable to wear and I find myself moving to adjust them despite them having not moved at all, they sit so lightly.

The sound quality is unlike any other speakers or headphones I've ever owned. The clarity and quality of the sound is just ****ed, basically. I'm not an audiophile by any stretch of the imagination, but I can't imagine a human would ever need more expensive headphones because I honestly don't know how much better audio output can get. I am finding myself hearing new sounds due to the increased range, and the balance of treble and bass is another class altogether of what I'm used to. I've listened to familiar music as well as worn them while playing a few rounds of TF2 (which I've been playing for over a year now) and I think I'll be ditching my headset altogether, despite the tactical advantage that voice chat provides in a game like TF2.

I've wanked for long enough. Anyone in the market for headphones should just get a pair of Porta Pros; they'll possibly inspire a similar wank of text.

My head w/ Plantronics headset
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v648/Devest8r/IMG_0068.jpg

My head w/ Koss Porta Pros
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v648/Devest8r/IMG_0066.jpg

If anyone is interested, I got them from here (http://www.velvetsystems.com/Koss.PORTAPRO.cfm)

[Vicious]

@TAT

Glad you're enjoying them. Just a few notes:

The adapter is probably gold plated, it's pretty standard.

Regarding the size, these are an earpad based fit so they rest on the ear so you just position where you want them. If you want an over-ear design in the future you'll want a set of full sized headphones.

Lastly, regarding losing voice for TF2. Consider a clip on mic like the one from Zalman (ZM-MIC1 if you can find it). They're quite well rated so you can get an improvement all around while not sacrificing a thing (save moderate convenience).

[drzaius]

on the headphone front;
I just bought a naim headline (+napsc) and k701's on ebay.

cant wait to try them out. will update.

and in other news - my sonos (streaming flac) is sounding amazing after the addition of a dacmagic.

[TrinityJayOne]

So my Sennheisers finally broke a little while back (my own fault, snapped the cable off right at the base) and I'm on the hunt for a new pair. I'm after a headset as I've been meaning to get a mic for gaming for ages, and at some stage I plan to rig up a universal 3.5mm adaptor for my 360 as well. Requirements-

-Must be a headset
-Must be cans. I wear a headset that sits on your ear at work all day and they shit me.
-Preferably open, as will not be used in public
-Heavily biased towards Sennheiser products, will consider other brands if reasoning is exceptional
-Primary usage will be mostly gaming, but also music, movies & TV.
-Willing to spend up to $200~. Hardly an audiophile but I know what sounds good and I want something that will last me for years.

The Sennheiser PC 360 G4ME (http://www.sennheiser.com/sennheiser/home_en.nsf/root/private_headsets_pc_pro-gaming_504122?Open&row=2) has caught my eye. It has everything I want and the reviews are excellent, but everywhere I called today had never heard of it. A very helpful PC store called Sennheiser for me as they said it wasn't on the massive order they just lodged with them, and apparently they aren't available in Aus yet. :( Still, I'm not against importing if I have to, plenty of pals in the US/Europe who could post it for me.

Failing that, there's the readily available PC 350s that it replaced for about $130-ish (on Amazon, so would need to import). These are closed cans however, and I read reviews that complained about not being able to hear yourself speak, or when you can it sounds all muffled like you have the flu. They also have a high impedance that many say results in barely-there bass from a PC unless you use an amp. I don't have an amp, so if I had to fork out for that too I might as well just be buying the 360s.

Discuss!

[Pai Mel]

Just purchased an Allure Blu-ray player from Clive for $99. I took the demo unit from the shop as that was all they had in stock.

I just noticed that when playing a Dolby TrueHD soundtrack, my Yammy AVR can't add any of its virtual soundspaces to the audio, like you know, how you can select from programs like 'Adventure', 'Drama', 'Church', etc. to add some reverb to the sound. Is that simply because I don't have a high-end AVR? Or is there just too much audio bandwidth to process?

[drzaius]

i'm liking the K701's.

Listening to mainly classical and they sound nice and airy.
I've heard they improve after considerable wear in so i'm trying to use them as much as possible and neglecting my speakers.
I've found that they are a bit uncomfortable to lie down with because the large earpieces touch my pillow and push up on my ears. VERY comfortable when standing/sitting though.

Also added a CDX and a power supply for my preamp.

My hifi rack is now insufficient.

[Creedy]

I'm finally moving into the granny flat (bachelor pad OK!)and will finally be buying some proper rear speakers and a sub.
I have Paradigm Monitor 9's for my fronts and either getting Paradigm Titan Monitor's or Monitor 7's for my rears. The Titan Monitor's are bookshelf speakers while the Monitor 7's are floor standing speakers.
The Monitor 7's are roughly $100 extra then what the TitanMonitor's are.

Maybe Vicious can make a more informed decision on what I should do?
Hell, I'm even tempted to save up for Monitor 11's and use my Monitor 9's as my rears. lol

[Vicious]

Before I suggest anything I of course like to know what electronics you're using to drive the speakers - it can make quite a difference when considering clipping distortion. Last I remember it was a Sony receiver, not sure what you're using now. I'll need brand & model.

Once I have that info I can make a better educated suggestion.

[Creedy]

That's right, I never mentioned what new receiver I ended up getting at the beginning of the year.
I have a Onkyo TX-875.

[Vicious]

A step in the right direction going with an Onkyo.

From what I understand it has a bit of dynamic power behind it, so if you don't push your speakers too hard the odds of clipping go down dramatically. I would suggest getting a rack fan unit for it though as they run a bit hot, or find another active cooling solution to help cool it down some. It's pretty easy to make your own fan unit if you don't mind splicing and a bit of soldering too.

Here's my thoughts on the buying situation:

Odds are you're going to want to use the crossover on the receiver to send most bass frequencies to the sub . . . probably starting at 80hz or so. Most bookshelves, including the Titans, should be able to play to 80hz quite well. Considering that I think investing in another set of towers isn't the best idea. I'd invest more in a sub at this point - where you really want the bass to go (don't forget to set your speakers to "small" in the receiver - that enables the xover management)

I'm guessing you already have the center channel? If not make sure not to skimp on it.

One thing you need to buy is a SPL meter. The Onkyo TX-875 doesn't seem to come with any auto-calibration, so you'll need to fix levels and distance yourself if you haven't yet.

Other than that, I'd consider demoing an external amp for the 9's sometime and see if it helps taking a load of the Onkyo amp section. Not sure the size of the room, how far away you sit, and the levels you play at. If you sit about two meters away your receiver can push the speakers to about 100dB without clipping - which is about right for extremely dynamic scenes. Much beyond that and I'd say you're asking a bit too much of the internal amp section.

[Creedy]

I'll take a photo of my "pad" at the end of this month.
I have no idea how I'd fit a fan in the entertainment unit I have bought, you'll have to see what I mean when I get everything set up end of month.

[Vicious]

I'll take a photo of my "pad" at the end of this month.
I have no idea how I'd fit a fan in the entertainment unit I have bought, you'll have to see what I mean when I get everything set up end of month.

I see. Just to make sure we're on the same page though, when I say rackmount fan I mean something like this:

Zbreeze (http://www.audioadvisor.com/prodinfo.asp?number=PAZBREEZE)

Obviously this is overpriced, but all it is is three 80mm (or 120?) fans placed in a unit that goes above the offending piece of gear to help dissipate heat. They're usually no more than 5 cm or so tall.

How much clearance do you have above the receiver roughly?

[Creedy]

I certainly have more then 2 inches clearance in my new entertainment unit.
So I just sit that thing on top of my AV receiver and it keeps it cooler? It does get pretty damn hot.

[Vicious]

I certainly have more then 2 inches clearance in my new entertainment unit.
So I just sit that thing on top of my AV receiver and it keeps it cooler? It does get pretty damn hot.

That's the point, it just pushes and pulls air through the top vents on the receiver more effectively. A few people I've chatted with use them and say it brings the temps down substantially. The active fan in the receiver seems to come on a bit too late and a bit too loud for a lot of people. Some rack coolers are actually quieter.

If you have a guitar/pro-audio (not audiophile or "HiFi" unless you want to get gouged) shop that carries gig equipment near you then you can probably find something similar for a reasonable price.

There's also ways to make them rather cheap, but they're usually very ghetto and are pretty much considered stop-gap solutions for testing.

[Allick]

I want to get some over ear headphones for gaming and listening to music on my compy. I don't really need a mic and I want ones that are comfortable and would ideally like to pay no more than $60 or $70. Also I may occasionally use them for playing my PS3, so I'd like for them to have a long wire or maybe wireless. Any recommendations?

[Vicious]

I want to get some over ear headphones for gaming and listening to music on my compy. I don't really need a mic and I want ones that are comfortable and would ideally like to pay no more than $60 or $70. Also I may occasionally use them for playing my PS3, so I'd like for them to have a long wire or maybe wireless. Any recommendations?

There's not a lot in your budget honestly . . . you could go for the AKG K512, but you won't find a lot of love for them. I'd consider upping the budget to around $100 and get the Audio Technica ATH-AD300 instead, which sounds good for the price and is VERY comfortable and has a 3M long cable (roughly).

[Allick]

Alright, I'll look into those thanks.

[Creedy]

I am once again absolutely blown away by how much better my speakers sound having moved into my "bachelor pad". The accoustics for this room are so much better then my tiny room in the house.
I get to listen to all my movies again for the first time.

[Vicious]

I am once again absolutely blown away by how much better my speakers sound having moved into my "bachelor pad". The accoustics for this room are so much better then my tiny room in the house.
I get to listen to all my movies again for the first time.

If you have the space you may also want to consider making some acoustic panels or bass traps. I only wish I had the space to do that myself . . .

[Creedy]

I won't need acoustic panels, I have sliding doors to the right and behind my lounge. I'll be putting nice curtains up over those doors. They should provide some nice absorption.

[Vicious]

I won't need acoustic panels, I have sliding doors to the right and behind my lounge. I'll be putting nice curtains up over those doors. They should provide some nice absorption.

Not. Really. That's about as flawed as the idea of using egg cartons.

All the curtains will impact at best are the really high frequencies, which tend not to reflect very much anyway. Acoustic panels are for mid-bass/mids, and bass traps are just that - to get rid of bass standing waves in the room to prevent undesired resonance.

[Creedy]

Not like I can put acoustic panels on glass sliding doors or anything though.

[Vicious]

Not like I can put acoustic panels on glass sliding doors or anything though.

True, you probably will have a hard time stopping first reflections in that position unfortunately.

[Pai Mel]

Heh, if you have bass reflection problems just use those vibration bass transducers on your couch, and don't use an audio subwoofer. Your neighbours will love you too. Or position the subwoofer closer to you at a position where it won't cause as much problems.

[Vicious]

Heh, if you have bass reflection problems just use those vibration bass transducers on your couch, and don't use an audio subwoofer. Your neighbours will love you too. Or position the subwoofer closer to you at a position where it won't cause as much problems.

Everyone has bass reflection problems - even with bass traps. Just the nature of the beast.

On the other hand, I do use those transducer over a subwoofer now in my current rig (Buttkicker Gamer) now that you mention it. I packed my sub since I'm in an apartment that doesn't take well to loud bass, not to mention it works with my headphones nicely ;)

[Creedy]

I don't have asubwoofer yet but I now have ample space for an Ultracube 12 when I save up the money.

[Vicious]

I just started using the larger earpiece that came with my sub $100 canal phones to create a better seal and the difference is amazing.

There is music IN my head. It's orgasmic.

Which canal phones are you using?

[TrinityJayOne]

So my Sennheisers finally broke a little while back (my own fault, snapped the cable off right at the base) and I'm on the hunt for a new pair. I'm after a headset as I've been meaning to get a mic for gaming for ages, and at some stage I plan to rig up a universal 3.5mm adaptor for my 360 as well. Requirements-

-Must be a headset
-Must be cans. I wear a headset that sits on your ear at work all day and they shit me.
-Preferably open, as will not be used in public
-Heavily biased towards Sennheiser products, will consider other brands if reasoning is exceptional
-Primary usage will be mostly gaming, but also music, movies & TV.
-Willing to spend up to $200~. Hardly an audiophile but I know what sounds good and I want something that will last me for years.

The Sennheiser PC 360 G4ME (http://www.sennheiser.com/sennheiser/home_en.nsf/root/private_headsets_pc_pro-gaming_504122?Open&row=2) has caught my eye. It has everything I want and the reviews are excellent, but everywhere I called today had never heard of it. A very helpful PC store called Sennheiser for me as they said it wasn't on the massive order they just lodged with them, and apparently they aren't available in Aus yet. :( Still, I'm not against importing if I have to, plenty of pals in the US/Europe who could post it for me.

Failing that, there's the readily available PC 350s that it replaced for about $130-ish (on Amazon, so would need to import). These are closed cans however, and I read reviews that complained about not being able to hear yourself speak, or when you can it sounds all muffled like you have the flu. They also have a high impedance that many say results in barely-there bass from a PC unless you use an amp. I don't have an amp, so if I had to fork out for that too I might as well just be buying the 360s.

Discuss!
So knowing that I have a decent tax refund on the way (buggered up forms at new job and was taxed 1/3 of my pay for 3mths), I've splashed out on a pair of 360s from a UK retailer. :D

Now, everything I'll be using them for will be running through my PC. Currently my sound is onboard because I've never had a reason to do better, but if I were to buy a decent soundcard would this negate the need for an amp? If yes, would it need to be a decent 5.1 card? (sharehouse, surround is not an option for me)

Vicious?

[Vicious]

So knowing that I have a decent tax refund on the way (buggered up forms at new job and was taxed 1/3 of my pay for 3mths), I've splashed out on a pair of 360s from a UK retailer. :D

Now, everything I'll be using them for will be running through my PC. Currently my sound is onboard because I've never had a reason to do better, but if I were to buy a decent soundcard would this negate the need for an amp? If yes, would it need to be a decent 5.1 card? (sharehouse, surround is not an option for me)

Vicious?

Best bet IMO would be the Auzentech X-Fi Forte. It basically has a discrete headphone amplifier directly on the card. In fact, the amp circuitry scores perfect marks in RMAA and provides a low output impedance too for a decent damping factor - and should have enough power to support the Senns without clipping at most listening levels.

Product Page (http://www.auzentech.com/site/products/x-fi_forte.php)

You can buy it here (http://www.pccasegear.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=8756) it seems.

Also worth noting is the sound card provides DDL, which if you want to hook it up to a receiver or other digital surround processor is a nice thing to have. I don't even use the analog circuitry of my Prelude anymore, but wouldn't give it up because I do use DDL regularly with my SU-DH1.

[TrinityJayOne]

Without clipping at most listening levels? Define "most"! I like to play things quite loud. Not standing-infront-of-a-rock-concert-speaker loud, but enough that someone could stand behind you shouting and you wouldn't notice.

[Vicious]

Without clipping at most listening levels? Define "most"! I like to play things quite loud. Not standing-infront-of-a-rock-concert-speaker loud, but enough that someone could stand behind you shouting and you wouldn't notice.

Without knowing exact headphone impedance across the frequency spectrum and knowing the Forte's max voltage and current output it's a bit hard to guarantee anything is probably what I should have said. Here's what I'm figuring though:

The max power of the Forte is 100mW per channel. I'd say the minimum is 10mW (a safe estimate at the highest load due to voltage limits). That gives +9dB over initial mW - if Sennheiser measures SPL/mW accurately it should be enough to cover up to 100dB and still have headroom for dynamic range easily without have large distortion from either the transducer or amp (less than 1% THD from the whole thing, if Sennheiser quoted absolute worst THD from their headset though questionable).

Without knowing exactly how Sennheiser measures sensitivity and the power ratings I can't say it won't clip ever though, but I think you'll be safe as long as you don't listen to levels that cause permanent hearing damage.

Still, I'd have purchased well measured headphones and a mic separately myself. In-line volume control, high cost in comparison, and headsets lack of use for audio make them less reliable, more expensive, and harder to find full measurements for.

[TrinityJayOne]

Good enough for me! ;) Cheers

[TrinityJayOne]

Not on phone now so gave it a proper once over, and it looks like it'll do the job very nicely. It's at Scorptech for $7 more than that site, but I like them and they're within pickup range (plus I need to get some bulkier stuff I'd rather not fork out shipping for at the same time).

Thanks again for the advice.

[Vicious]

Not on phone now so gave it a proper once over, and it looks like it'll do the job very nicely. It's at Scorptech for $7 more than that site, but I like them and they're within pickup range (plus I need to get some bulkier stuff I'd rather not fork out shipping for at the same time).

Thanks again for the advice.

Yep, no problem :D

[TrinityJayOne]

Got home to find that my housemate had been here for the courier that delivered them today. :D Only 7 business days, was expecting much longer! (Estimate was 10-15) As such I don't have the Auzentech yet, but already they are glorious and beyond levels of comfort that I am able to express through words alone.

[TrinityJayOne]

So, ordered the Auzentech yesterday from Scorptech, was sitting at home for me tonight. Huzzah! This thing has absolutely blown me away, I can listen to my higher bitrate MP3s at ear-bleedingly high volumes (for 10sec at most mind you o.O) without the slightest hint of distortion or peaking. My only complaint so far is that I don't have such good results with my Xbox, but I think this is just a sign of less-than-brilliant mixing in one or two games. Affected sounds seem to do it regardless of the volume I use, but turning down the volume from the game seems to help.

But yeah, everything else is flawless. I'm hearing sounds in WoW that I never knew existed. :D

A very, very happy purchase.

[nintendo]

I bought a pair of AKG 518 DJs for $150. Is that an alright pair for an alright price?

I bought them to use on my iPhone most of the time. Although with sein now releasing a range with inline controls I'm tempted to grab one of them.

[Vicious]

I bought a pair of AKG 518 DJs for $150. Is that an alright pair for an alright price?

I bought them to use on my iPhone most of the time. Although with sein now releasing a range with inline controls I'm tempted to grab one of them.

I really can't comment on price since it's different from the US. Distortion characteristics of AKG monitor/DJ line is unpredictable, but on average is at least below 3% THD at 90dB. The FR isn't going to be neutral and will likely favor one or two ranges over another (bass, mids, treble). I'd need to see a spectral decay graph to see how decay is, but with most headphones it usually isn't a large issue.

[Allick]

I might get some in new earbuds or in ear headphones (I'm currently using iPod earbuds which are pretty poor). I'm willing to spend up to 80 or maybe 100, but I want them to last a while and be pretty durable because I've broken a few headphones before, and I'm really after quality too. Any recommendations would be appreciated.

[Vicious]

I might get some in new earbuds or in ear headphones (I'm currently using iPod earbuds which are pretty poor). I'm willing to spend up to 80 or maybe 100, but I want them to last a while and be pretty durable because I've broken a few headphones before, and I'm really after quality too. Any recommendations would be appreciated.

Don't know what to tell you honestly at that price point. For home use a pair of Audio Technica ATH-AD300 would probably suffice if you don't toss them around too much. If you want a pair that can be beat to hell and back and still be covered under warranty there's the Koss Portapro for $134 (Australian) - a hefty price, but the warranty is lifetime.

[Pai Mel]

Koss PortaPros are only £17.99 + £1.95 postage from http://www.mymemory.co.uk/Overhead-Headphones/Koss/Koss-PortaPro-Headphones

If you use the code "BACKFORGOOD" you get 5% off the item price.

I've also seen them on ebay for $44 posted.

From the YouTube review I've seen on them, apparently the metal headband can get a bit uncomfortable, but the 'phones offer excellent sound quality, with really solid bass.

[Vicious]

Koss PortaPros are only £17.99 + £1.95 postage from http://www.mymemory.co.uk/Overhead-Headphones/Koss/Koss-PortaPro-Headphones

If you use the code "BACKFORGOOD" you get 5% off the item price.

I've also seen them on ebay for $44 posted.

From the YouTube review I've seen on them, apparently the metal headband can get a bit uncomfortable, but the 'phones offer excellent sound quality, with really solid bass.

That's a large difference from headphones.com.au . . . makes them quite a better deal.

[Italian Stallion]

I don't even need another pair of headphones, but at that price, I think I might order some Portapros anyway!

Allick seemed more interested in earbuds & maybe canalphones etc than headphones though. >_>

[Pai Mel]

I prefer headphones, because when you wear them it's more apparent to other people that you should not be disturbed.

[Allick]

Yeah I was more interested in earbuds. I ended up getting a set of Ultimate Ears Metrofi 220s after hearing good things about Ultimate Ears. They're pretty comfy, and the sound quality is much better than my iPod earbuds.

[Vicious]

I don't even need another pair of headphones, but at that price, I think I might order some Portapros anyway!

Allick seemed more interested in earbuds & maybe canalphones etc than headphones though. >_>

Oops, I saw the word "headphones" and skipped over "in-ear".

Still, seems Allick picked up something okay. If those die in the future and he wants a low cost set Denon also makes okay entry level stuff.

[lex3191]

After a few years of running a pair of pretty nice sounding Dali suite series speakers, not sure what model number I am at work will check when i get home, through a pretty average Yamaha RXsomething AV reciever I want to upgrade my hand-me-down Yamaha RX? to a new AV reciever. I have always liked the Cambridge Audio line of AV receivers and have recently be thinking about purchasing the new Cambridge Audio Azur 650R 7.1 http://www.cambridgeaudio.com/summary.php?PID=493 and I was wondering if anyone had any thoughts on it.

I will be using it obviously for TV and movies but I also listen to music through my current set up. I also game usually with headphones, the Audio Technica ATH-AD900s running into my Yamaha AV. The 650R is a little pricey and it only has 3 HDMI 1.3 imputs and i dont plan to upgrade to 5.1 or 7.1 speaker set up. From what I have read the Azur 650R sounds great for both music and AV stuff.

I was also considering purchasing a centre speaker, so i would end up with a left and right speaker and a centre. Any thoughts? Worth taking the plunge on the receiver? Worth getting a dedicated centre speaker? Thanks

[Vicious]

The 650R shouldn't be too bad, it seems to measure rather well. I personally wouldn't put any 4 ohm nominal speakers on it, but for the normal stuff it should go quite well. I'd also consider the NAD T765 too.

Make sure either one you get comes with a solid warranty.

The bottom of your post confuses me a bit though. Are you only using three channels? If you don't plan on going 5.1 or more then you'd be better off putting the money into a DAC, integrated amp, and speakers (probably a sub).

[lex3191]

Hey thanks Vicious. My thinking with the centre speaker was that I believe dvd's etc are encoded to run dialogue through the centre speaker of a 5.1 set up. I was wondering if the same principle would apply using a 2 speaker set up.

I'm not sure if the my Dali speakers are 4 or 8 ohm I will have to check. It has been a while since I hooked them up to the Yamaha.

I was also considering a DAC something like the Cambridge Audio DACMagic http://headphones.com.au/psingle?productID=451 but as I run both my TV and Xbox through HDMI I felt i would only get benefit from it through my PC which i run into my reciever to play lossless music files.

[Vicious]

Hey thanks Vicious. My thinking with the centre speaker was that I believe dvd's etc are encoded to run dialogue through the centre speaker of a 5.1 set up. I was wondering if the same principle would apply using a 2 speaker set up.

Well, yes and no. Most dialogue runs through the center channel, but this can cause issues in some movies that are really well mastered. See, what will happen is if a character is talking off screen or walks into the screen the audio may transition from back to front left to center, or something similar. Thus you may miss parts of a the dialogue entirely or have trouble deciphering it when they're off screen. Or a noise that becomes the main focus that the characters look towards you may not hear and may cause confusion for the viewer. Unless you're going full 5.0/1 it's a bad idea IMO. This coming from experience doing it . . . >_>'

I'm not sure if the my Dali speakers are 4 or 8 ohm I will have to check. It has been a while since I hooked them up to the Yamaha.

Please do check the model number. I checked some of the discontinued Suite series on their site and they seem to be 4 ohm. I'm surprised none of your audio gear has fried, but you've probably been listening to a lot of distortion on them without even realizing it honestly.

I was also considering a DAC something like the Cambridge Audio DACMagic http://headphones.com.au/psingle?productID=451 but as I run both my TV and Xbox through HDMI I felt i would only get benefit from it through my PC which i run into my reciever to play lossless music files.

Your 360 should still be able to do optical, but you may need to get a different cable for it. Most HDTV's still have optical outs (or at least a cable box). Of course you'd then probably want to use a Toslink switch, possibly with integrated repeater (I use one switch with repeater then another in-line repeater for my setup, and yes I mean true powered repeaters >_>').

As for the DacMagic, I own one myself. I actually sold off my Cary Audio Xciter DAC so I could buy one and some other gear. The jitter measurements (non-usb) are in line with the Benchmark DAC ;)

[lex3191]

Hey Vicious. I have the Dali suite 1.7 speakers. They have a nominal impedance of 4 ohms. Just in case you are curious I have a Yamaha RX-V457 which is stated as an 8ohms amp, it has an impedance selector switch which I set when I first put the system together, but i don't ever crank the system anyway, so i guess its OK. So what do I do with these 4 ohms speakers to use them properly on an 8 ohms amp run them through a power amp?

[Vicious]

Hey Vicious. I have the Dali suite 1.7 speakers. They have a nominal impedance of 4 ohms. Just in case you are curious I have a Yamaha RX-V457 which is stated as an 8ohms amp, it has an impedance selector switch which I set when I first put the system together, but i don't ever crank the system anyway, so i guess its OK.

The switches for 4 and 8 ohm a receivers are actually problematic, audioholics (http://www.audioholics.com/education/frequently-asked-questions/connecting-4-ohm-speakers-to-an-8-ohm-receiver-or-amplifier) outlines the issue fairly well.

I just checked NAD and it appears the T765 I mentioned earlier does support 4 ohm loads according to the data sheet on their site. I'd consider emailing and asking at what levels does it start clipping into 4 ohms, and if the "soft-clipping" feature is a rail voltage limiter. Also ask if the rating is a dynamic power rating or continuous.

The Cambridge makes no mention of 4 ohm loads.

So what do I do with these 4 ohms speakers to use them properly on an 8 ohms amp run them through a power amp?

You normally run them through an external amp, or something called an integrated amp (which serves as a stereo preamp/amp combination) from a line level source. Some A/V receivers in the past have done alright, but they're rare. Some receivers can be used like a surround preamp processor for decoding, but they need preouts. Your Yamaha doesn't do this unfortunately, so there's no real add-on to it.

[lex3191]

Hey Vicious Thanks for the advice. I checked out the NAD T765 and it looks really great. A little out of my price range I am afraid. I bought the Dali's off ebay for only a couple of hundred and the Yamaha is a hand-me-down, I am a little annoyed that they are 4 ohm I looked at the other Dalis in the range and they all seem to be 6ohm so even they would be not entirely compatible with an 8 ohm AV receiver.

[Vicious]

Hey Vicious Thanks for the advice. I checked out the NAD T765 and it looks really great. A little out of my price range I am afraid. I bought the Dali's off ebay for only a couple of hundred and the Yamaha is a hand-me-down, I am a little annoyed that they are 4 ohm I looked at the other Dalis in the range and they all seem to be 6ohm so even they would be not entirely compatible with an 8 ohm AV receiver.

Isn't the T765 $2500 over there? Is it that much more than the $2200 were you looking at, or were you getting a deal on the 650R? You could email Cambridge and see what they would suggest - if the 650R would work with 4ohm alright at moderate listening levels (it's tricky not knowing the levels without some word from the manufacture unforunatley - it may have some ability it may have none).

Still, don't forget to consider improving your stereo experience if you decide against the receiver as it should be affordable in the budget you're looking at. Even when you do upgrade to a full 5.1 system most people will find a use for an integrated around the house, or be able to resell it for a fair amount when they're done with it ;)

[lex3191]

I haven't done thorough research of prices here in AUS, but the AV place near my house has it listed at $3499 AUS http://www.carltonaudiovisual.com.au/?q=node/view/1127, and the Cambridge listed at $2200.

you think i should look at an integrated stereo receiver? I did think about that as I use the Yamaha in the same way. Any you would suggest? thanks

[Vicious]

I haven't done thorough research of prices here in AUS, but the AV place near my house has it listed at $3499 AUS http://www.carltonaudiovisual.com.au/?q=node/view/1127, and the Cambridge listed at $2200.

Found it as JustKlapp (an official distro) for $2500 (http://www.justklapp.com/KLAPP_AV/client/ProductCatalogue/c_catalogueThumbs.jsp?categoryID=4&childCategoryID=31&selBrand=NAD). For some reason their product page for it seems pooched, but the buy option still works. You can probably give them a ring if you're concerned about avialability or shipping.

What do you mean about an Integrated? How could I improve my set up without forking out for a new receiver. Go 5.1 you mean.

An integrated is basically a stereo receiver, just many have a lot of better amps in them (thus the term integrated amp - it's a preamp and amp in one). I'm pretty sure the DAC and Integrated solution would work well if you don't plan on going 5.1 anytime soon.

NAD C316BEE (http://www.justklapp.com/products/Amplification/Integrated%20Amplifers/NAD%20C316BEE%20Stereo%20Integrated%20Amplifier), the next step up has a sub-output and a bit more power here (http://www.justklapp.com/products/Amplification/Integrated%20Amplifers/NAD%20C326BEE%20Stereo%20Integrated%20Amplifier), both pretty affordable considering. Then you have the dacmagic (http://clefhifi.com.au/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=504) which you can probably knock $100 bucks off or more. For toslink switching I found a forum that had a couple suggestions here (http://www.stereo.net.au/forums/showthread.php/21188-HDMI-Optical-audio-Switch-box-help!?p=316559). The Inday seems familiar to the Audio Authority box I have, but the one on monoprice seems to be able to strip the audio off HDMI and send it out overs toslink or coax (the DacMagic has a good clock for jitter recovery, so I wouldn't worry about either one myself as long as they're powered).

If you go with the higher integrated out of the two excellent budget bangers you could also probably get a decent sub and go 2.1.


Either way I'm just listing options I've stumbled upon. You guys get really screwed over their on audio cost. Most of my setup is used, but even if it wasn't you guys seem to pay a lot more for gear.

[lex3191]

Hey thanks Vicious. It seems that the two NAD integrated amps you suggested can handle 4 ohms speakers and they sound like a really good solution to my problem. The way I run my set up at the moment, as the Yamaha AV receiver I have doesn't have HDMI is to run all my AV devices through my LCD TV and then run the audio out into the Yamaha. I also run an optical cable from my PC into the Yamaha. It might not be pretty but it works for my needs. I think you may have suggested a sensible solution.

I have a small odd shaped lounge room, so I definitely don't plan to have a 5.1 set up. So It would probably be overkill to go for a AV receiver with my current set up anyway.

So If i say picked up one of the NADs and the DAC magic, if I still ran the audio through the TV and into the receivers would that be OK or would the sound get 'rubbished' by running it through the TV first. If so then adding the HDMI switch would sort that out. I am however trying to minimise the complexity of my system, so my wife can work it:p

[Vicious]

and the DAC magic, if I still ran the audio through the TV and into the receivers would that be OK or would the sound get 'rubbished' by running it through the TV first.

Depends. Which TV is it and do you know if it's a true audio pass-through or not? If you don't know the model I'll do some digging, the idea is you want to avoid resampling (at least at the front-end to say the least).

If so then adding the HDMI switch would sort that out. I am however trying to minimise the complexity of my system, so my wife can work it:p

The HDMI to toslink I linked you to also acts as an HDMI switch IIRC, and should be automated based on priorities. She basically wouldn't have to worry about switching, just turning on the device.

As for complexity . . . I'm not the one to simplify it. I have a four way toslink splitter and repeater into a repeater splitter into a Pre-Pro and Victor Dolby Headphone adapter, then the PC hooked up the the DAC and the DAC splitter to the Pre-Pro and a switch (which has a splitter to my BK Gamers too) with the Victor, which go to a headphone amp. I then have my front channel speakers on a switch since I have a set for stereo listening then the ones that match my whole stereo and it's so... O_O', and that's not even all of it with my TT, CD, etc.

The whole layout took me a couple days to figure out which bits and pieces I would need to get everything working how I wanted. The integrated solution is a cake walk in comparison :p

[nintendo]

omg. I just tried my pair of standard iPhone earphones because I was hesitant to take my AKGs with me. I don't really like not having a bag or something with me to store them in so I thought I'd try the iPhones.

Jesus. F***king. Christ.

I didn't even know the quality could be that different. Wtf have I been using all these years. My ears felt like they were being raped by the iPhones. Like they were being pummeled. I don't know how anyone can put up with these things now even though I used to defend them.

I hereby renounce anything I've ever said in the past that was positive about them. They are trash. They ruin audio.

[lex3191]

nice set up man. I have a Sharp Aquos 46 inch LCD, as for the exact model number I'd have to check the back of the unit, which unfortunately cant do right now. I would think it wasn't a true pass-through though. simplicity is an issue for me. I dislike lots of remote controllers etc. I have all my functions mapped to my tivo remote which works well. I would like a new amp though. so i just need to weigh up whether the simplicity and cost of the NAD T765 AV is a better option than the integrated, DAC, switch option.

[Vicious]

nice set up man. I have a Sharp Aquos 46 inch LCD, as for the exact model number I'd have to check the back of the unit, which unfortunately cant do right now. I would think it wasn't a true pass-through though. simplicity is an issue for me. I dislike lots of remote controllers etc. I have all my functions mapped to my tivo remote which works well. I would like a new amp though. so i just need to weigh up whether the simplicity and cost of the NAD T765 AV is a better option than the integrated, DAC, switch option.

Well the switch can pretty much be setup as automated, so it shouldn't be a big deal.

@Nintendo

Which AKG's do you have?

[drzaius]

I didn't even know the quality could be that different. Wtf have I been using all these years. My ears felt like they were being raped by the iPhones. Like they were being pummeled. I don't know how anyone can put up with these things

I don't so much notice that my system sounds good anymore, only that other things sound bad.

[nintendo]

@Nintendo

Which AKG's do you have?

I have the 518djs. I picked them up based purely on price, looks, and having had a quick try of my friends pair.

I know they may not be the best but god damn they are a hell of a step up from what I had. They even have me thinking about spending even more money on a better pair, although preferably ones with inline controls, just because the difference is astounding. I think Id describe it just like the drzaius. I just notice when I try other headphones that they are terrible. These sound normal. correct, if you follow me.

Ive tried my friends Seinhouser (sp), and AKGs but they dont sound anywhere near as good. Admittedly he paid less than $150 for his Seinhousers (sp) and he got the AKGs for free from Tafe, but even they dont sound anywhere near as good.

EDIT: Just thought Id note that when I first got these bad boys it was exciting to go back and listen to all my music again. It was like Id never heard how it should sound before. It was amazing.

[Creedy]

Today I put my Paradigm ADP-390's on lay by. I can't wait to get these rear speakers hooked up!!!

http://www.paradigm.com/products/paradigm/surround-rear/monitor-series/adp-390

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v121/Creedy/649.jpghttp://img.photobucket.com/albums/v121/Creedy/648.jpg

They cost me $1300 including the stands.
All that will be left to get is my sub woofer, maybe I'll get that at the beginning of next year.

[Vicious]

Today I put my Paradigm ADP-390's on lay by. I can't wait to get these rear speakers hooked up!!!

I can't say I'm a fan of dipole since I prefer distinct imaging, but it still looks like everything is coming together quite well :D

[Pai Mel]

Ideally, every speaker in a surround setup (bar the sub) should be identical, but your room is going to affect the sound anyway. Those ADP-390 should make the surround channels pretty lush. I hope your center channel speaker is a real good one, otherwise you've overspent on surrounds.

[Creedy]

I have a Paradigm Monitor CC-290.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v121/Creedy/512.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v121/Creedy/511.jpg

I am very tempted to upgrade to the CC-390. I might check it's price once I pay off my rears.

[Creedy]

I had a sneak peek at my ADP-390's today, I didn't know the bass driver was the bass driver from the floor standing Monitor 11's!! God damn well can't wait to get these bad boys hooked up for sure now.

[Vicious]

I had a sneak peek at my ADP-390's today, I didn't know the bass driver was the bass driver from the floor standing Monitor 11's!! God damn well can't wait to get these bad boys hooked up for sure now.

Looking good so far. Make sure to take pics of your setup soon so we can all oggle it :D

[Creedy]

Took a few quick shots with my phone.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v121/Creedy/pad2.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v121/Creedy/pad1.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v121/Creedy/pad3.jpg

All I need to do is buy a sub-woofer now.

I will most likely put my ADP-390's up on the rear wall at a later date. It's good to finally have surround sound again that's for sure. Dipole's have a very interesting sound to them, especially when situated right near the seating area as the sound doesn't come directly at you. It kind of surrounds the whole area.

[Pai Mel]

Very nice. White Xbox looks out of place. Need to trade up to a S black model. :p

I prefer the placement of rears behind my sitting position.

But yeah setup looks good.

[Vicious]

So, are the mains Monitor 7s, 9s, or 11s?

In other news sold my Magnepan's . . . they were taking up way to much space even now that I have an apartment. Replacing them with a set of NHT Classic Two's.

[Creedy]

Sorry, the mains at Monitor 9's.

[Vicious]

Sorry, the mains at Monitor 9's.

Very nice. My NHT's came in and sound wonderful. I also fixed my turntable's anti-skate recently. My albums sound great (save NiN the slip - the pressings SUCKED) on it.

Maybe I should take pics of my setup. My HT speakers don't look as nice though :p

[Lex]

Best pair of headphones for around $100 go!

I have no idea what I'm looking for, I've only ever used the shitty earbuds that came with the players.

[Italian Stallion]

For portability or home use? You obviously don't want a huge pair if you plan on taking them out..

Care about noise leaking in & out? Closed have better isolation, open aren't good at isolation but sound better.

[Lex]

Portability, mainly, but I'm not bothered if they're a bit big.

Noise leaking isn't really something I've thought about, is it a big issue? I guess I'd rather have better quality.

[lex3191]

Headphonic (http://headphones.com.au/) have a good range with good prices. Here are some they recommend under or around $100. They will deliver too.

Audio Technica: ATH-SQ5 (http://headphones.com.au/psingle?productID=370)

Koss: KSC-75 (http://headphones.com.au/psingle?productID=173)

Sennheiser: HD238 (http://headphones.com.au/psingle?productID=420)

or if you want to get great sounding headphones for around $150 you can't go past these,

Audio Technica: ATH-AD700 (http://headphones.com.au/psingle?productID=178)

although these might be a bit bulky for what you are after.

[Italian Stallion]

Leaking being an issue depends. If you're on public transport or in loud areas a lot, it can be annoying (both for you and people around), but otherwise, not really.

The ATH-AD700s are amazing for the price. Awesome sound and super comfortable.. but they leak like a sieve and are pretty massive. I have them and don't take them out just because of the size. They also aren't bass-heavy - I find it fine, but some people don't like them because of it.

Those SQ5s are pretty good, and the ES7s (http://headphones.com.au/psingle?productID=226) are even better. I have a pair and use them out, fairly compact and sound great. They can be a bit tight though, but that's easy enough to fix.

Alessandro MS-1s (http://www.headphones.com.au/psingle?productID=19) are meant to be very good too. Will probably sound better than anything here other than the AD700s, but also leak a lot.

The Koss are meant to be good, and you can get them dirt cheap from the US.

Shure SRH240s (http://headphones.com.au/psingle?productID=444) and SRH440 (http://headphones.com.au/psingle?productID=445) are also very good in their respective price ranges.

tl;dr - SRH240 for <$100, SRH440 or ES7 for <$150 for closed (flip a coin), MS-1 for open but still portable (imo).

[Super Sleuth]

Headphonic (http://headphones.com.au/) have a good range with good prices. Here are some they recommend under or around $100. They will deliver too.

Audio Technica: ATH-SQ5 (http://headphones.com.au/psingle?productID=370)
.

I've had a set of these for a couples of years now I love them. Still going strong as well.

[Vicious]

Portability, mainly, but I'm not bothered if they're a bit big.

Noise leaking isn't really something I've thought about, is it a big issue? I guess I'd rather have better quality.

It definitely depends on the environment. To enjoy the music on an 'open' headphone you're not wanting to hear outside noise. For this to happen it must be quiet so on busy roads, building, etc. you really won't be able to hear you music. You'll also be tempted to drown it out by turning the volume up which is dangerous as it can permanently damage your hearing obviously.

If it is quiet, odds are you're going to get bitched at for annoying others like at a library.

IMO, open is sometimes okay for portable use if you need to hear the environment around you. Otherwise outside noise or people will cause a hindrance and they should be used at home.

For isolation your best options are in-ear monitors (IEMs) or close headphones.

I wrote a guide on another forum under my other alias "Shike" specifically for headphones and how to possibly go about choosing them here (http://www.xbox360forum.com/xbox-forum/threads/113599-Reasonable-Audiophilia-Vol-1-Headphones). I warn you it is lengthy, but it's a good crash course into headphones and what to look for depending on what you want.

If you have any experience with other audio items like expensive speakers or at least can give us an idea of some headphones you've heard and enjoy it can make things easier to suggest as it gives us a possible measured point of reference.

Feel free to let me know if this helped at all or if you have any questions.

[Lex]

Audio Technica: ATH-AD700 (http://headphones.com.au/psingle?productID=178)


I really like the look of these, thanks for the suggestion!


tl;dr - SRH240 for <$100, SRH440 or ES7 for <$150 for closed (flip a coin), MS-1 for open but still portable (imo).

Also thanks! The ES7's look very cool, and tbh that's all I'm really basing my decision on atm :P

It definitely depends on the environment. To enjoy the music on an 'open' headphone you're not wanting to hear outside noise. For this to happen it must be quiet so on busy roads, building, etc. you really won't be able to hear you music. You'll also be tempted to drown it out by turning the volume up which is dangerous as it can permanently damage your hearing obviously.

If it is quiet, odds are you're going to get bitched at for annoying others like at a library.

IMO, open is sometimes okay for portable use if you need to hear the environment around you. Otherwise outside noise or people will cause a hindrance and they should be used at home.

Well, I'll be using them on public transport a lot, so I guess I don't want anything that will piss people off, I mean shit, I tend to crack it at that one guy who I can hear blasting enter sandman from the back of the bus every day.

I think I'd rather closed over IEM's, I've used IEMs before and they just feel weird to me. I think I have 2 different sized ear holes, but none of the default rubbery bits ever felt right to me.

I wrote a guide on another forum under my other alias "Shike" specifically for headphones and how to possibly go about choosing them here (http://www.xbox360forum.com/xbox-forum/threads/113599-Reasonable-Audiophilia-Vol-1-Headphones). I warn you it is lengthy, but it's a good crash course into headphones and what to look for depending on what you want.

Ok, had a skim through that, and I understand a little better what I'm getting into. Great guide though, even a dunce like me understands it, thanks!

If you have any experience with other audio items like expensive speakers or at least can give us an idea of some headphones you've heard and enjoy it can make things easier to suggest as it gives us a possible measured point of reference.

You'll hate me, but I've only ever used ibuds and cheapass logitech speakers on my PC, so really, absolutely anything is gonna sound worlds better, I'd imagine.

But thanks a bunch for the response man, really helpful!

[Lex]

After reading a bunch of reviews, I'm thinking I'll go with the ES7's, unless there's something for a similar price that's better?

[Italian Stallion]

I recently picked up a set of Klipsch speakers & matching sub to replace a Pioneer HTiB I've got, so I'm after a bit of advice on a new receiver.

I know Klipsch speakers can sound rather bright, so I'm after an amp to warm the sound up a little.. I've been told Onkyo, Denon or Marantz is the go, with Onkyo seeming to be, by far, the most popular choice - possibly because they seem to be more widely available locally.

I'm on a pretty tight budget (since I didn't really need new speakers, but the deal was too good to pass up..), but I've come across the Onkyo TX-SR508, TX-SR507 & TX-SR577 (which I can, for some reason, seem to get cheaper than the 507). I'm leaning towards the 507/577 as it seems to be a good few hundred dollars cheaper, with the only advantage with the 508 being HDMI 1.4a support - I don't have bluray anyway, and it seems as though a lot of bluray players are being released with dual HDMI ports which would kind of negate this requirement anyway. The other addition on the 508 seems to be DPLIIZ or something, which would be useless for my setup.

Any comments/suggestions appreciated!

[Vicious]

I know Klipsch speakers can sound rather bright, so I'm after an amp to warm the sound up a little.. I've been told Onkyo, Denon or Marantz is the go, with Onkyo seeming to be, by far, the most popular choice - possibly because they seem to be more widely available locally.

Okay, let's get rid of a myth here: amps will not "warm up" or "color" the sound if they're designed properly. What you can do is use some form of equalization to try and bring the top-end down - which receivers or processors may or may not have.

You could also try and find some simple cotton or foam dispersion panels which sometimes take out the top bite from harsh frequencies.

I'm on a pretty tight budget (since I didn't really need new speakers, but the deal was too good to pass up..), but I've come across the Onkyo TX-SR508, TX-SR507 & TX-SR577 (which I can, for some reason, seem to get cheaper than the 507). I'm leaning towards the 507/577 as it seems to be a good few hundred dollars cheaper, with the only advantage with the 508 being HDMI 1.4a support - I don't have bluray anyway, and it seems as though a lot of bluray players are being released with dual HDMI ports which would kind of negate this requirement anyway. The other addition on the 508 seems to be DPLIIZ or something, which would be useless for my setup.

Any comments/suggestions appreciated!

The TX-SR577 has Audyssey 2EQ which should use a mic and may correct some of the high-end on the Klipsch's.


The question I have first and foremost is: which Klipsch speakers did you get?

[Italian Stallion]

Okay, let's get rid of a myth here: amps will not "warm up" or "color" the sound if they're designed properly. What you can do is use some form of equalization to try and bring the top-end down - which receivers or processors may or may not have.

You could also try and find some simple cotton or foam dispersion panels which sometimes take out the top bite from harsh frequencies.
Hmm, I see. Where does this myth come from? I've been told it by a number of salesmen (I know, not necessarily the best place for info), and read it online all over, most people saying Onkyo, Denon, Marantz, some of the Pioneers all sound warm, while Yamaha, JVC, Sony and so on all have a bright sound? Funnily enough the majority of the quality brands seem to be labeled as warm, so maybe it's just because they sound better?
The TX-SR577 has Audyssey 2EQ which should use a mic and may correct some of the high-end on the Klipsch's.
Yeah, I've been told that does a fairly good job in general, with some need for minor adjustments.
The question I have first and foremost is: which Klipsch speakers did you get?
Just a set of the Quintets, and a Synergy Sub-10. It's not for a large room, and wasn't really a planned upgrade.

[Vicious]

Hmm, I see. Where does this myth come from? I've been told it by a number of salesmen (I know, not necessarily the best place for info), and read it online all over, most people saying Onkyo, Denon, Marantz, some of the Pioneers all sound warm, while Yamaha, JVC, Sony and so on all have a bright sound? Funnily enough the majority of the quality brands seem to be labeled as warm, so maybe it's just because they sound better?

It could be a variety of things. There's placebo (some people believe cables make a difference when we can measure that nothing audible has been changed), preconceived notions, and bias.

The only time I'd say there's potential for differences to be noticed is if the amplification section of the receiver is clipping which adds particularly harsh distortion. However, it's generally a flip of the coin on whether the speakers and receiver will cause this to happen - the fact that the notion is so far spread seems to be more psychological based and word of mouth subjectivist claims being taken as fact.

There was a study which I'd have to dig up, but when reviewers and audio engineers were blind folded they found no audible differences between some very cheap and very expensive solid state amplifiers. However, this test also made sure nothing was driven till clipping distortion either.

Yeah, I've been told that does a fairly good job in general, with some need for minor adjustments.

Well the first thing I'd do is hook them up to whatever you have now and just try them first. Even a cheap stereo receiver if you have one, just to see if you find the treble distracting. When I listened to Klipsch I did, but now at 22 I'm finally starting to take on some hearing loss that happens with all guys as they age that's corrected the issue (I can now listen to Grado headphones without feeling they're "bright").

Just a set of the Quintets, and a Synergy Sub-10. It's not for a large room, and wasn't really a planned upgrade.

Audioholics said they didn't find the treble distracting. However, I'd try them on something first and see what you think before you go out of your way to correct something you may not even hear. Quintets being "micro" speakers will also probably play well with a lot of entry level receivers, they (micro speakers) don't tend to take a lot of current to drive.

[Italian Stallion]

So basically, any good quality receiver should sound about the same as the next?

My old HT was an all-in-one HTiB with matched components. The sub had the receiver built into it, so I'm going to require a new one at any rate. They also quote 4 ohms in the manual, whereas the Quintets say 8 ohms - to my knowledge I shouldn't be mixing components which quote different numbers? So I imagine I can't even use it to test..

Who would be the brands to look out for? Onkyo, Yamaha, Sony & Pioneer seem to be the most common here. Denon are available, but the prices are quite a bit more than I'd like to spend.. Would the Onkyo I mentioned be sufficient, you think?

[Vicious]

So basically, any good quality receiver should sound about the same as the next?

In this particular case it should be fine. Now if we were dealing with speakers like Magnepan, Martin Logan, some esoteric 4 ohm stuff, or something with high degrees of electrical phase then things get down to the nitty gritty to say the least.

My old HT was an all-in-one HTiB with matched components. The sub had the receiver built into it, so I'm going to require a new one at any rate. They also quote 4 ohms in the manual, whereas the Quintets say 8 ohms - to my knowledge I shouldn't be mixing components which quote different numbers? So I imagine I can't even use it to test..

Does it say 4 ohms minimum? 8 ohms is usually an easier load with receivers, so I'd see no reason it wouldn't work. Which HTiB was it so I can pop-up a copy of the manual and see?

Who would be the brands to look out for? Onkyo, Yamaha, Sony & Pioneer seem to be the most common here. Denon are available, but the prices are quite a bit more than I'd like to spend.. Would the Onkyo I mentioned be sufficient, you think?

Onkyo is usually a solid choice if you're looking at HT receivers. Personally I go all separates, but for this case it should be more than sufficient.

[Italian Stallion]

In this particular case it should be fine. Now if we were dealing with speakers like Magnepan, Martin Logan, some esoteric 4 ohm stuff, or something with high degrees of electrical phase then things get down to the nitty gritty to say the least.
I'll keep that in mind when I decide to buy some Martin Logan speakers. :p I've actually heard that name mentioned a bit lately.. how come in the case of those speakers the receiver affects the sound?

Does it say 4 ohms minimum? 8 ohms is usually an easier load with receivers, so I'd see no reason it wouldn't work. Which HTiB was it so I can pop-up a copy of the manual and see?
Nope. Just says 4 ohms. I've got a printscreen of the relevant page on the manual below. I could well be reading it wrong, of course! ;)

http://img401.imageshack.us/img401/3362/57735634.th.jpg (http://img401.imageshack.us/i/57735634.jpg/)

Onkyo is usually a solid choice if you're looking at HT receivers. Personally I go all separates, but for this case it should be more than sufficient.
All separates? What do you mean by that?

[Vicious]

I'll keep that in mind when I decide to buy some Martin Logan speakers. :p I've actually heard that name mentioned a bit lately.. how come in the case of those speakers the receiver affects the sound?

Martin Logan are electrostatic hybrid speakers which are different from dynamics. Well, everything but the bottom end where it uses a dynamic driver like a sub to fill in the bottom end.

Why the receiver would effect the sound is, quite frankly, the amplifier section in any HT receiver to date has proven generally inadequate to power them.

The reason for this has to do with electrical phase and the dynamic section for the ML's being notorious for presenting less than a 4 ohm load even (which I'd probably take out with a xover myself should I get a pair in my life - ever).

Nope. Just says 4 ohms. I've got a printscreen of the relevant page on the manual below. I could well be reading it wrong, of course! ;)

http://img401.imageshack.us/img401/3362/57735634.th.jpg (http://img401.imageshack.us/i/57735634.jpg/)

You're reading it right. Normally if it supports both it will have a value for each rating unless its amplifier section is compromised. It seems this one is worse than a lot of them though.

All separates? What do you mean by that?

A HT receiver is a collimation of several electronics put into a single enclosure. You have the preamp/processor section and the amplifier section. The preamp/processor section even has it's own DAC (digital analog section) due to necessity to decode HT audio like DD and DTS.

What this means is, while the box is all-in-one self contained and easy to setup it ultimately means it is compromised. The power supply for a good amplifier is usually much larger and heavier than what can fit in a HT receiver enclosure thanks to the added parts. Heatsinking is also inadequate to cool the amplification section.

When it runs out of power for the load presented it clips (a distortions that's known to be harsh and kill tweeters) - this is due to the power section being inadequate and the design not supporting it properly. On the other hand the heatsinking section prevents from dying prematurely if it can, but under heavier loads you can expect at least a protective shut-down under a best case scenario.


Separates goes about doing exactly what it sounds like. The preamp processor section has its own enclosure, the amplifier is in its own, and while most DACs don't support HT audio codecs many like to have them as a dedicated audio device for stereo listening.

So my setup for example has a NAD T163+ V2 that I got off ebay for $75 USD off ebay not working and fixed myself. Looks like crap, but around that time it was still worth around $800USD refurbed and I wanted something cheap. My amplifier is a Niles SI-1200 -- it supports 12 channels at 25W 4/8 ohms with low distortion, or two can be bridged for a 50W 8ohm channel only (with my speakers and distance 25W is sufficient). Then I have a separate DAC I use for music (Cambridge DacMagic) which I use for stereo.

Everything is separated out which means one section isn't compromised by another -- the compromises presented are based solely on the cost and design of the unit. This form of buying HT costs more upfront, but IME will be cheaper in the long run because when you have to replace one item you don't replace them all . . . and you get better peformance. However, the initial investment scares people off, and it's substantially more expensive for you guys over there in Aussie land.

EDIT:

Just to give you an idea of what the inside of a separate amp looks like:

http://lh4.ggpht.com/_qQq7IsRuilM/TSq8e_AOxCI/AAAAAAAABvc/ERWpunzShT0/Capture.JPG

This is 12 ch opamp design like my Niles, though it produces 40w into 8 ohms and 60w into 4 ohms. It uses a push-pull fan design on either side of the heatsink to cool the chips, and is made for installers and rack mounting mostly. This is popular for people that want zone controls so they can have music in multiples rooms.

[Italian Stallion]

It definitely was a cheap and nasty setup, but I couldn't complain for the ridiculously cheap price, and I couldn't afford anything else at the time anyway! I gather that means definitely not to try my new speakers with it? :)

How does the ohm thing work? Is lower or higher better? Clueless here..

Ah I see. That all makes sense. I'd love to go that way one day, but right now it's not really cost-effective or viable for me. And as you say, we seem to get raped with prices in Australia.

I think I'll order the 577 later tonight..

[Vicious]

It definitely was a cheap and nasty setup, but I couldn't complain for the ridiculously cheap price, and I couldn't afford anything else at the time anyway! I gather that means definitely not to try my new speakers with it?

I wouldn't try it IMO. It seems that this may oddly be voltage limited which means it would be clipping from the get go which could destroy the tweeters. So yeah, you're pretty much going to need a new receiver in this case.

How does the ohm thing work? Is lower or higher better? Clueless here..

Not necessarily, it's just the load presented to the amplifier section.

This goes back to ohms law; the lower the impedance the higher the amount of current you need. A lot of amp sections in receivers don't provide enough current. The higher the load, the more voltage you need - most amps can do this just fine.

The situation is even worse though, because speakers aren't a static load. At one frequency they can be 8 ohms and the next they can be 2 ohms (or 16+, but that's less worrisome). That's why you see "8 ohms nominal" - it's really just an average. In the case with the quintet they're probably like my SuperZero XU's - never dropping below 8 ohms anyway. On the other hand some speakers like Focals can go all over the place in impedance. And we haven't even touched electrical phase which is another issue entirely that means your power could be cut in half or worse!

For example, I said I got 25W into 4/8 ohms correct? Well my NHT Classic 2's really operate around 5 ohms, but that's not the issue (they'd still get 25W if that was the only thing to go by).

They have an electrical phase of 45 degrees. This means that I'm dissipating twice the power (heat), but only receiving half of it (12.5W)! Given, my speakers are sensitive enough that since I'm only 6' away on average that this doesn't present an issue, I can still get into low 90dB range for loudness without clipping. However, it DOES highlight the issue.

In comparison, my Super Zero XU speakers get roughly 21W since they're electrical phase is only 22 degrees.

A simple explanation of electrical phase is how much current or voltage leads the other. While it seems unlikely, voltage can arrive sooner than current and vice-versa. This is another difference that impacts electrostats - they are a capacitive load (current leads) while dynamics are inductive (voltage leads).

This is a reason electronics engineers have to plan for in-rush current in some other electronics (not necessarily amps, though it's probably a concern there too with electrostats) which can do nasty things like blow transistors if not properly designed.

If you really want to see why this is the cluster**** it is this (http://sound.westhost.com/patd.htm) makes for an interesting read on the subject.

If your head doesn't hurt enough already I can talk about all sorts of interesting things - like damping factor/output impedance of the amp itself. :p

[Cerebral]

Thinking about getting a new pair of headphones/amp setup. Already Decided on the AD700s since headphones.com.au dropped the price to $150, but I don't know jack about amps. Don't want to pay a lot of money, are cmoy amps pretty much the best value for money portable headphone amps out there?

Thought about building one myself, which I prob could do given enough time, but it would probably suck and I'd prefer to just buy off ebay. Also the novelty of having an amp in a mint tin is ****ing cool.

Edit: By portable I really mean just small. It probably won't leave my room.

[Vicious]

Cmoy or FiiO E5 should work fine. If you go for the cmoy see if you can get one that's wallwart only with higher voltage on the rails. If it's being built from scratch ask them for a possible quote and see if you can pay the difference from there listing to have it done that way.

Beyond that it should work fine. The AD700 doesn't pose a hard load IME.

[Lex]

listening to my new ES7's with my new sansa clip+.

I've been doing it wrong for so long. This is amazing. Thanks for the help dudes.

[edit] is it actually worth breaking them in with pink noise? some people seem to think it's nessecary, others say it's just a placebo

[Vicious]

listening to my new ES7's with my new sansa clip+.

I've been doing it wrong for so long. This is amazing. Thanks for the help dudes.

[edit] is it actually worth breaking them in with pink noise? some people seem to think it's nessecary, others say it's just a placebo

I'm of the placebo belief myself. Reason being I've seen five headphones measured starting at 0 hours to 250 hours and none of them changed in the slightest beyond margin of error. The drivers don't have the same weight and force behind them like subwoofers which often do show measurable differences - and very early on in comparison.

Furthermore, a recent study done on subwoofers shown if they weren't consistently used after break-in they returned to their original characteristics. This meant without constant use the break-in didn't matter.

Last but not least, if you're of the belief they break-in it would happen with regular music listening anyway (which in reality is why many believe it's merely us adjusting to the headphones for obvious reasons).

That's where I stand. Then again I've been called a heretic and blasphemer on audiophile voodoo at Head-Fi and other places before.

[dinopoke]

Just found out about this (http://www.turtlebeach.com/products/audio-processors/ear-force-dss.aspx). Are these things too good to be true?

[Vicious]

Just found out about this (http://www.turtlebeach.com/products/audio-processors/ear-force-dss.aspx). Are these things too good to be true?

They're very headphone dependent, but I have something similar (Victor JVC SU-DH1) that's works quite well actually. They all use Dolby Headphone.

But yeah, units I know of that do this are:

Mixamp
EarForce DDS
SU-DH1 (Victor label for wallwart use) - also support DTS while using Dolby Headphone.

The first two also are fairly capable in amplification, where the SU-DH1 basically NEEDS another amp so it can run at half volume and lower potential noise/THD. In terms of surround positioning it does sound like the surround speakers are at the side/a little behind you, a center sounds center, and the fronts sound at roughly 30 degree angles in front in comparison. Basically if you've ever done an HT level test, I did that with DDL on my PC and it sounded like that. Plenty of channel separation, given I use K601's which are very flat DF equalized which DH depends on quite a bit.

[fishfishmonkeyhat]

http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/audiophiles.png

Thinking of you guys. :o

[Vicious]

God, doesn't he know it at least takes 10 watts to fill up a living room?

(no seriously . . . that's how much it take to get to a little over 90dB in my listening position. Well, unless he has some 95dB/w+ sensitivity speakers . . . then I'd be jealous. They look like this:

http://www.acapella.de/img/Sphaeron.jpg

Or these

http://www.fergusonhill.co.uk/script/get_image.php?image_id=2

See, those things look amazing don't they? 100dB/w. Well, not sure what the electrical phase of them . . . that could drop the amp to 1.5W . . . but at their sensitivity I doubt it matters.)

[fishfishmonkeyhat]

http://i348.photobucket.com/albums/q321/fishfishmonkeyhat/Emoticons/MyEyes.gif

[Shorty]

http://www.acapella.de/img/Sphaeron.jpg

Or these

http://www.fergusonhill.co.uk/script/get_image.php?image_id=2

This I can get behind. If you're going to spend a ridiculous amount of money on speakers, they should look ridiculous, too.

[Italian Stallion]

<snip>
I think I'll leave reading that link for another day. Confused enough as it is. :o Seems like quite a bit to get your head around.. for now I'll content myself with knowing my new amp seems to be the right match. :p

I did end up getting an Onkyo, the TX-SR508. Seem to have gotten it for a decent (Australian) price, and it has everything I could come up with that I needed. About 10x easier than the old Pioneer receiver we have to set up as well.

First impressions of the Quintets was that they're damn heavy compared to the speakers in the HTiB I had before. After hooking them up, I'm super happy with them. Only have them in a 3.1 config right now, until I can set the rears up.. but the sound is fantastic. Tinkering with things to try and get the perfect sound out of them, but even after just using the Audyssey setup thing they sound great. Haven't noticed any of the brightness that seems to be associated with Klipsch stuff either.
Thinking about getting a new pair of headphones/amp setup. Already Decided on the AD700s since headphones.com.au dropped the price to $150, but I don't know jack about amps. Don't want to pay a lot of money, are cmoy amps pretty much the best value for money portable headphone amps out there?

Thought about building one myself, which I prob could do given enough time, but it would probably suck and I'd prefer to just buy off ebay. Also the novelty of having an amp in a mint tin is ****ing cool.

Edit: By portable I really mean just small. It probably won't leave my room.
Good choice. I love my AD700s. So comfortable and sound great.
listening to my new ES7's with my new sansa clip+.

I've been doing it wrong for so long. This is amazing. Thanks for the help dudes.

[edit] is it actually worth breaking them in with pink noise? some people seem to think it's nessecary, others say it's just a placebo
The difference is pretty night and day when compared to iBuds etc, and the ES7s are super for the price. A mate's just ordered a pair after hearing mine the other day too. :D

[Silverwolf]

esw9 shittin all over your damn es7s

=)

[Lazlow]

Thinking about ordering AD700s with a Fiio E7 from headphones.com.au

Any reason why I shouldn't?

[Vicious]

Thinking about ordering AD700s with a Fiio E7 from headphones.com.au

Any reason why I shouldn't?

None that really pop into mind. Maybe see if you can get something from NuForce a bit cheaper, but if not that's an alright way to go. I'm guessing you have a noisy laptop/PC output which is why you need USB?

[Lazlow]

Well that's the thing I'm trying to figure out.

I've currently got an aging rig (9 years) with onboard sound. I do get some distortion, and I generally find the sound a bit flat. That said nothing impressive is plugged into it, Logitech X series 5.1 speakers which take up all three outputs, so my current headphones (Sony MDR-XD100) just get plugged into the output on one of the front speakers.

I am looking at getting a new rig in the coming months, and I'm considering getting a dedicated soundcard. My PC has slowly become my main entertainment hub, and I'd like to getting back into music recording and programming.

I've tried to figure out whether I'd really need an amp, but most posts responding to that question seem to echo "manufacturers cheap out on internal headphone amps, you'll need a stand alone".

So while my current setup benefits from one, would I really need a new one with a new setup?

[Italian Stallion]

I don't know how something like this (http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/FastTrackPro.html) performs compared to other audio devices, but it seems to sound quite a bit better than onboard. Perhaps Vicious may have an idea of how it compares?

In any case, something like that wouldn't cost much more than the Fiio, and it has the added advantage of inputs for recording guitar etc. I have one and it works well, but there's plenty of other choices on the market.

I'm under a similar impression that a dedicated soundcard always sounds better.. it seems that manufacturers have upped their game in recent years, and it won't sound bad, just not as good as it should!

I'm obviously a fan of the AD700s though. :cool:

[Lazlow]

I was thinking of getting a Guitarport XT (http://line6.com/guitarport/) for the guitar.

Only other device is a 25 key USB midi controller.

[Vicious]

I am looking at getting a new rig in the coming months, and I'm considering getting a dedicated soundcard. My PC has slowly become my main entertainment hub, and I'd like to getting back into music recording and programming.

For an external sound device for recording I've always heard good thing about the EMU-0404. Of course I'm assuming you aren't using your PC for gaming, if you are there's some internal cards that offer really good performance for music, movies and gaming -- but probably not recording.

I've tried to figure out whether I'd really need an amp, but most posts responding to that question seem to echo "manufacturers cheap out on internal headphone amps, you'll need a stand alone".

That's not always true; however, if your onboard is noisy or distorting then it's an issue regardless. I've heard laptops with solid onboard sound, then theres examples like my Vostro 1500 which hisses, hums, and crackles all over the place. Same for desktop units.

So while my current setup benefits from one, would I really need a new one with a new setup?

It all depends unfortunately. I'm not sure if you're looking for a mostly external or internal device. Either one you could probably use with your current PC -- assuming we are talking about a Windows box. Things get more complex with Macs (driver support for the 0404 on them is shoddy, and I don't know internal cards for them).


All in all the AD700 is an extremely easy load. An amp of low to moderate capability should be able to drive it to painful levels without distortion (assuming you aren't already suffering hearing loss beyond the average).

[Lazlow]

I'm assuming you aren't using your PC for gaming

Oh I will be. Got a few games in the "for when I get a new PC" pile. And yeah it'll be a Windows box.

The recording/programming will be more of a hobby, so I won't be seeking out anything too pro. A decent internal card will probably do me just fine.

Think I'll get the E7. If I find I don't end up needing it, I can always flog it off to someone. Plus the new PC is still probably a few months off yet.

[Vicious]

Oh I will be. Got a few games in the "for when I get a new PC" pile. And yeah it'll be a Windows box.

The recording/programming will be more of a hobby, so I won't be seeking out anything too pro. A decent internal card will probably do me just fine.

Think I'll get the E7. If I find I don't end up needing it, I can always flog it off to someone. Plus the new PC is still probably a few months off yet.

Alright, when you do go for the new PC and want an internal card to use something from Auzentech or Asus. Their newer cards are made to drive headphones specifically, though they've slowly moved away from EAX. Instead they've started integrating Dolby Headphone though (which works well when using DDL), which I'm a fan of for games and movies mostly.

[Lazlow]

Placed the order. What the f***en at Headphonic not processing credit cards? Had to do direct deposit, and becuase they're with NAB they wont get the money until tomorrow. Add in the public holiday on Wednesday, chances of me getting them this week (I paid for express post) are slim.

[Vicious]

Placed the order. What the f***en at Headphonic not processing credit cards? Had to do direct deposit, and becuase they're with NAB they wont get the money until tomorrow. Add in the public holiday on Wednesday, chances of me getting them this week (I paid for express post) are slim.

Well when you do get everything make sure to post your thoughts. The AD700s are seriously comfy and fairly balanced sound for the price IMO.

[Lazlow]

BTW, dudes over at theforams (PC Powerplay spin off forum) are championing these (http://worldwide.bose.com/axa/en_au/web/ae2_audio_headphones/page.html)

Any thoughts?

[Lex]

All I've heard about Bose is that it's overpriced shit for people that don't know any better.

[Vicious]

My experience with Bose headphones (Triports) was that they were a bit too bassy when I tried them at a Sharper Image iirc. In terms of THD and everything else they're in the ballpark, but they also tend to run a bit higher in price to the competition.

Bose headphones really made their mark with active noise canceling models which became popular with businessmen that flew a lot. You could say that's their niche which other companies have started to overrun. Now they've branched out, but are priced to the high side of an already well filled market.

As much as I dislike saying this though, Bose headphones really aren't that bad, just overpriced. Their speakers on the other hand are atrocious for all intents and purposes (severe distortion and frequencies that aren't produced at all).

[Cerebral]

AD700s arrived today. Sounds freaking excellent, but the 3D wing band will take some getting used to. Got outbid on the cmoy amp though, will keep looking.

[Vicious]

AD700s arrived today. Sounds freaking excellent, but the 3D wing band will take some getting used to. Got outbid on the cmoy amp though, will keep looking.

Something wrong with the wing band that requires getting used to?

[fishfishmonkeyhat]

Any suggestions for 5.1/surround headphones?

[Cerebral]

Something wrong with the wing band that requires getting used to?

Sliightly uncomfortable, they push down a bit too hard on my head (and leave grooves in my hair). Not a huge issue, but I'm used to sitting the headphones on my ears and not relying on the band too much. It'd be great to be able to adjust the tension on them, but that's probably too small of an issue for anyone to bother integrating into the design.

[Vicious]

Sliightly uncomfortable, they push down a bit too hard on my head (and leave grooves in my hair). Not a huge issue, but I'm used to sitting the headphones on my ears and not relying on the band too much. It'd be great to be able to adjust the tension on them, but that's probably too small of an issue for anyone to bother integrating into the design.

Haven't heard that before. If nothing else they should slowly loosen with usage though :)

@fishfishmonkeyhat

Get a good pair of stereo headphones and a Dolby Headphone device like the Mixamp.

[fishfishmonkeyhat]

Is that cheaper/easier then just buying a single unit?

[Vicious]

Is that cheaper/easier then just buying a single unit?

Cheaper or easier, don't know . . . depend what you're comparing it with. Most "5.1" headphones though (that actually have a bunch of dinky speakers) generally sound awful and actually work worse. A pair of Sennheiser HD555, or even the ATH-AD700 with a mixamp and a clip-on Zalman mic produces good results (not the best, but good, and substantially better than the alternative).

[Lazlow]

Placed the order. What the f***en at Headphonic not processing credit cards? Had to do direct deposit, and becuase they're with NAB they wont get the money until tomorrow. Add in the public holiday on Wednesday, chances of me getting them this week (I paid for express post) are slim.

So according to the parcel tracking my order is ready for collection at my local post office.

Chuffed!

[Lazlow]

So they're pretty awesome.

The earcups are huge though, they engulf my ears and kinda rest on my carotid artery. It's not uncomfortable, just something to adjust to seeing my previous headphones fit snugly around my ear.

Funny thing is I plugged them initially into where I had my old headphones and the noise was a shit tonne more pronounced. No such issues with the E7 which is working fine, except I can't get my XBOX360 sound to go through it.

I have the XBOX line in through the soundcard, and even though I have all the outputs set to USB audio it still comes out through the speakers.

[Vicious]

So they're pretty awesome.

The earcups are huge though, they engulf my ears and kinda rest on my carotid artery. It's not uncomfortable, just something to adjust to seeing my previous headphones fit snugly around my ear.

You'll definitely get used to it. The pads only get softer and the headphones will slowly loosen to where only the necessary amount of grip is used. I'm pretty sure they were designated the "Air" design due to this, they get to the point where you don't even notice them (I've worn them so many hours when I don't want something snug like my K601).

Funny thing is I plugged them initially into where I had my old headphones and the noise was a shit tonne more pronounced.

They are extremely sensitive to noise compared to other headphones I have. For example I have a Mini^3 with an Alps potentiometer on it that's supposed to be silent. It's the only headphone I hear scratchyness with when I adjust volume on it.

No such issues with the E7 which is working fine, except I can't get my XBOX360 sound to go through it.

I have the XBOX line in through the soundcard, and even though I have all the outputs set to USB audio it still comes out through the speakers.

Not sure about this, I don't know how you're feeding sound to the PC and what sound card/onboard you're using. We'd need more info to help you on this assuming it isn't a driver issue.

[Creedy]

Vicious, do you know any sites that give good advice on how your speakers should be set up the best way? I mean in regards to tone, bass/treble.

My Monitor 9's and CC-290 centre sound really good and are in perfect harmony, when voices move from the centre speaker to one of the stereo speakers they sound the same.
I'm just having a hard time trying to get the right tone for the rear ADP-390's. I'm not very good at explaining what I mean but they sound a bit more ..... tin like, less refined. I really can't explain what I mean.

:(

[Vicious]

Vicious, do you know any sites that give good advice on how your speakers should be set up the best way? I mean in regards to tone, bass/treble.

Normally not messing with tone controls is for the best unless something is severely deficient. Even then parametric equalizers are used (and only used to get rid of peaks).

My Monitor 9's and CC-290 centre sound really good and are in perfect harmony, when voices move from the centre speaker to one of the stereo speakers they sound the same.
I'm just having a hard time trying to get the right tone for the rear ADP-390's. I'm not very good at explaining what I mean but they sound a bit more ..... tin like, less refined. I really can't explain what I mean.

First, how do you have them placed? A diagram or picture of your room would be most helpful (including your listening position). This is just a guess, but depending on how they're placed in regards to your listening position they may be too far off-axis (or possibly too much on-axis) which will impact the FR you hear.

If it's not too hard, take one of the bipoles off your wall and try positioning it so it's on-axis with your ear and away from the wall. Play either pure L/R music out of it. When I say on-axis I mean not the large cone on the side, but what would normally be off axis (the beige/white mid and tweeter). Does it still sound tinny? Try moving your ear roughly 45 degrees from the mid tweeter section. How does it sound when you do that?

If it sounds tinny on-axis but not off-axis, then the positioning of the speaker is too in-line with your ear (mid/tweeter). If it sounds tinny off axis but not on, then placement is still the issue (to far off-axis). If it sounds fine either way in comparison, then acoustic reflections from walls are the issue. If reflections are the issue you will want small 1 cubic foot (sorry, I don't know the conversion off the top of my head) acoustic panels placed on-axis with the mid and tweeter. That should dampen them out.

The only other option besides this that has somewhat decent results is either a built-in receiver fix (Audessy for example) or a parametric equalizer. Unfortunately these have varying degrees of success - acoustics are especially difficult to fix digitally IME.

This is the only problem I have with bipoles -- placement is extremely time consuming and difficult. When setup right they can produce amazing results . . . when not oddities tend to pop-up.

[Creedy]

I think you most likely hit the nail on the head, I have my bipoles set up on stands atm to the left and right of my lounge. You could say they are very in line with my ears.

The only option I have for putting the speakers on my wall is with the rear wall. Would you like me to take some photos of my set up and wall so you have a better picture?

The stands were an interim solution and I was intending to put my rears on the walls, just haven't got around to it yet. Wasn't sure if the rear wall would be suited for the task.

[Vicious]

I think you most likely hit the nail on the head, I have my bipoles set up on stands atm to the left and right of my lounge. You could say they are very in line with my ears.

The only option I have for putting the speakers on my wall is with the rear wall. Would you like me to take some photos of my set up and wall so you have a better picture?

The stands were an interim solution and I was intending to put my rears on the walls, just haven't got around to it yet. Wasn't sure if the rear wall would be suited for the task.

Any pictures, and a simple sketch that contains everything of interest. Listening position and a dotted line of the mid and tweeters firing angle in a sketch would give a better grasp of the situation too. Doesn't have to be anything fancy, but it would help if it's moderately to scale (not exact, but close enough for representation).

When you say "very in-line", do you mean the mids/tweeter or the larger bass driver? When I say in-line or on axis, I'm talking about the mids and tweeter and not the bass unit. If you're describing it sounding as sounding tinny, to me that sounds like the tweeter is too on-axis. Won't know till I see generally what's going on though.

[Creedy]

I should have got back to you earlier, sorry Vicious. This is my lounge area.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v121/Creedy/Bachelor%20Pad/2011-02-02_202949.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v121/Creedy/Bachelor%20Pad/2011-02-02_203032.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v121/Creedy/Bachelor%20Pad/2011-02-02_203022.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v121/Creedy/Bachelor%20Pad/2011-02-02_203009.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v121/Creedy/Bachelor%20Pad/2011-02-02_203057.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v121/Creedy/Bachelor%20Pad/2011-02-02_203109.jpg

[Italian Stallion]

Still damn impressed with the little Quintets for how small they are. They really blow away my previous setups! For the price & size, I don't think I could have done much better!

Curious what the consensus on audio cables is.. I know with HDMI etc it's generally all the same, but what about speaker cable? I've read up that over short runs, 16 gauge is fine.. true or false? Also, are there differences from one sort of cable to the next? Shielding, material used.. anything?

[Vicious]

I should have got back to you earlier, sorry Vicious. This is my lounge area.

The last pic is the most telling -- there's definitely some acoustic issues there. Still, I'm not sure if it's the acoustic issues making it sound funny or the speakers themselves. Have you tried the test I mentioned earlier? I'd use the left surround off the stand, or the stand away from the couch so you can easily move your left ear around the speaker without it being blocked. Is there any angle that doesn't sound tinny?

In terms of acoustic issues I'm seeing:

Your couch is blocking parts of the left surround speaker.
Your fridge is creating early reflections on the right surround speaker.

I'm not sure if this would create the "tinny" sound you describe, but it will make the rear surround tracks sound off in comparison.

Here's what I'd do:

Try placing your ear on different angles, see if it's less tinny at certain angles than others, or if it goes away entirely once you've eliminated possible acoustic problems.

If it's an acoustic problem, put the speakers about a foot higher. Put some acoustic treatment on the fridge side where the speakers backfiring is aiming.


If the speakers really are just that way:

You have a couple options. First, how did you notice they were "tinny"? Were you playing music through all of your speakers? Remember that dipoles weren't made for high quality music production, they were made to fill a large space with ambient sound effects for HT. If you don't notice this "tinny" problem in HT, stick to stereo music listening and don't worry about it.

The other option involves you probably selling them for a loss. If the sound bugs you too much and it can't be fixed, then the speakers just aren't going to work for you. Going over to a bookshelf design like the Atom or Micro as surrounds may be preferable. This would also eliminate a lot of acoustic issues assuming you can get them firing over your couch cushion rather than into it.


Either way, please keep us updated on this issue. I've always had a curiosity in regards to room acoustics and want to know if it's somehow responsible or not ;)

Still damn impressed with the little Quintets for how small they are. They really blow away my previous setups! For the price & size, I don't think I could have done much better!

Probably not. My SuperZero XUs do solid for my HT with their dispersion characteristics. I have my sub kick in at roughly ~100hz to fill in the bottom end though.

Curious what the consensus on audio cables is.. I know with HDMI etc it's generally all the same, but what about speaker cable? I've read up that over short runs, 16 gauge is fine.. true or false? Also, are there differences from one sort of cable to the next? Shielding, material used.. anything?

Speaker cable is just fine at 16 gauge for most rooms. For material, any cheap multi-stranded copper will do. There's plenty of DBTs and measurements that show you aren't going to notice a difference beyond it.

[Creedy]

At work at the moment so can't try anything you mentioned yet.
I can tell you though that i noticed the audio difference during Die Hard 2. A scene where Mclain is shooting and the camera changes so you hear Mclain shooting from behind so you hear the gun sound in the rear right speaker.

[Silverwolf]

Finally completed my modest PC/TV setup for my room, since my FiiO E7+E9 combo finally arrived today after ordering them a month ago.

So worth it though, the difference in quality the E7+E9 make to my headphones (AudioTechnica ESW9) is incredible. I also connected my new Audioengine A5s and it's improved them too (probably mostly because the E7 acts as a DAC and its infinitely better than onboard)

Plus when i'm feeling fussy I can take my E7 with me and use it as a portable amp with my iPhone, cause it makes a huge difference there too.

[dinopoke]

What are some decent cheap earbuds for under $20? I'll mainly use them out and about so durability is a priority. Heard Shure is good but not sure which model or whether it fits my budget.

[Lex]

>decent
>under $20

choose one.

[dinopoke]

Is 'best under $20' better for you?

[Italian Stallion]

Creative ep630, which are Sennheiser CX300s - which you might also be able to get for around that price. There's some on eBay, dunno if they're legit though.

Sound Magic (despite the name!) and Brainwavz stuff is pretty well-renowned for the price too, but you probably won't find them locally.

Everything else is going to be equally crap, so it doesn't matter which way you go.

You won't be able to get Shures for under about $100.

[Cerebral]

Finally completed my modest PC/TV setup for my room, since my FiiO E7+E9 combo finally arrived today after ordering them a month ago.

So worth it though, the difference in quality the E7+E9 make to my headphones (AudioTechnica ESW9) is incredible. I also connected my new Audioengine A5s and it's improved them too (probably mostly because the E7 acts as a DAC and its infinitely better than onboard)

Plus when i'm feeling fussy I can take my E7 with me and use it as a portable amp with my iPhone, cause it makes a huge difference there too.

Pretty keen on getting an E7, since I'm also using onboard sound for my PC - am I right in assuming the amplification from the E7 is merely adequate and you're using the E9 to drive something a bit more power hungry? Was thinking I might just get an E7 to drive my AD700s and see how that goes.

[Silverwolf]

I use the E9 because it has the perfect combination of inputs and outputs for my setup. I needed two 3.5mm inputs for PC and TV, and at least two outputs (one being line-level) for headphones + speakers, plus the E9 puts priority on the headphones so plugging them in cuts sound to the speakers.
The E9 amplifies better the E7 (not significantly though), and also lets me use the E7 as a DAC instead of using onboard sound for my PC. I don't think using the E7 alone will let you use it as a DAC via PC.
You can get a E7 and E9 combo together for $190 at mp4nation.com (http://mp4nation.net/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=25&products_id=458), which is a bargain considering the E9 is usually ~$150 and the E7 ~$80.

You won't REALLY need to amplify the AD700s since they only have a resistance of 32ohm, but it definitely wouldn't hurt. Since you're using onboard though and don't have a soundcard, i'd recommend getting both. I thought onboard was passable until I got these but the difference is enourmous.

[Silverwolf]

What are some decent cheap earbuds for under $20? I'll mainly use them out and about so durability is a priority. Heard Shure is good but not sure which model or whether it fits my budget.

Echoing the statements that you aren't going to get anything good for $20.
Earbuds for <$100 - http://headphones.com.au/pbrowse?catID=1&price=range1&subCatID=11
Canalphones for <$100 - http://headphones.com.au/pbrowse?catID=1&price=range1&subCatID=12

I don't know much about Earbuds/Canalphones, but these Hifiman RE0s I got for free from my friend (worth $120, score) are pretty great for Canalphones.

[Vicious]

Is 'best under $20' better for you?

JVC Marshmallow -- quite bloated in bass and fairly sibilant though.


You might be able to grab some OEM UE under Altec Lansing UHP336 (they use balanced armatures). Denon IEMs are also fairly well rated on the lower end of the price scale assuming you don't get counterfeits.

From the link Silverwolf recommended if you go the higher price route I'd say the Etymotic and SoundMagic are your best bets.

You won't REALLY need to amplify the AD700s since they only have a resistance of 32ohm, but it definitely wouldn't hurt. Since you're using onboard though and don't have a soundcard, i'd recommend getting both. I thought onboard was passable until I got these but the difference is enourmous.

While the impedance has some to do with the easiness driving the AD700, it's really the sensitivity more than anything else.

Regarding the E7 vs. E7+E9 combo . . . the E7 alone has more than sufficient power to drive the AD700's to deafening levels without distortion. Only if one plans on upgrading substantially in the future (and most likely to higher impedance AND low sensitivity headphones) should they really consider the combo. When I say low sensitivity, I mean vintage 600ohm AKGs for studios for example.

[Lazlow]

I have an E7 + AD700s; flavour country.

[Silverwolf]

Regarding the E7 vs. E7+E9 combo . . . the E7 alone has more than sufficient power to drive the AD700's to deafening levels without distortion. Only if one plans on upgrading substantially in the future (and most likely to higher impedance AND low sensitivity headphones) should they really consider the combo. When I say low sensitivity, I mean vintage 600ohm AKGs for studios for example.

Thanks for the clarification :~). I just wasn't sure if the E7 by itself would act as a DAC. Just tested it out and it does (via USB connection) so do that Cer, you won't regret it.

[Cerebral]

Cool beans~

[Vicious]

Few newish purchases. First speakers. Sold my Magnepan's after noticing an odd distortion on them that wouldn't go away. Eventually I figured it's probably since they weren't a true push pull design and that room reflections are used to mask it. So, I purchased a pair of NHT Classic 2's (I guess this makes me a NHT whore now or something?):

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/_qQq7IsRuilM/TYv6SLRSZkI/AAAAAAAAB2Q/Jr_edXNLnIM/s912/P1030796.JPG

The black speakers are the new ones. Purchased them used on ebay for around ~$300 USD for the pair. Cross them over high enough to sub that I should only be getting a max of 5% audible THD out of my whole system (90dB @ 2M) since I also use a steep filter to keep my sub happy at the low end (anyone that knows speaker THD knows how difficult that is!).

Next, new headphones:

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/_qQq7IsRuilM/TYv6MM9WMXI/AAAAAAAAB1M/x-q6zA7xAFU/s912/P1030695.JPG

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/_qQq7IsRuilM/TYv6MWZw1-I/AAAAAAAAB1Q/pb8sPKl84PU/s912/P1030737.JPG

Stax SR-202 powered by SRD-7 Pro . . . which I sold promptly after a week of use. They sounded like a neutered pair of K601's honestly, and for $400 USD that isn't good (especially since I have a problem with Stax reliability). I also purchased a pair of Stax SR-5 (vintage) for ebay fodder doubling my cash (bought for $60 or so, sold for $150 ;) )

So, I ended buying these instead:

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/_qQq7IsRuilM/TYv6QiyGEQI/AAAAAAAAB2A/FxORnATA95E/s640/P1030786.JPG

AKG K702 with Woo Audio stand. Has a bit of a midbass hump and bumped treble and I enjoy when listening to rock/metal while reading my books in my recliner . . . and yes, I'm powering them with a Mini^3. They're actually more efficient than my K601's, so the Mini^3 should be more than enough for them.

[Space_Monkey]

The right headphone of my Sennhiser CX 300-II headphones has died and I have foolish tossed the receipt and packaging… I’m wondering if they’ll still honor the two year warranty. I seriously doubt it but I thought I’d ask before handing over the money for a new pair. Has anyone tried making a warranty claim for Sennhiser headphones without a proof of purchase and if you have how did you go?

Failing a warranty claim I’m looking at a new pair. My budget is about $130, considering it’s a one off payment for something I use almost everyday I feel it’s worth the expenditure.

However I’m only after buds that I can toss in my bag/pocket/wear discreetly.

I’m looking at Sennhisers again because before the aforementioned failure they’ve been a great pair with excellent sound quality.

I thought about these but the microphone seems like a luxury rather than a necessity...

http://www.jbhifi.com.au/portable/mp3-players/head-phones/sennheiser/high-performance-noise-isolating-ear-canal-headset-sku-64438/

And for $50 less I can have these.

http://www.jbhifi.com.au/portable/mp3-players/head-phones/sennheiser/stereo-in-ear-canal-headphones-sku-18214/

Unless the sound is noticeably better in the most expensive model I wouldn't want to bother.

Or I could go for a compromise and get these ones but I imagine the sound quality would be weaker than both of the above.

http://www.jbhifi.com.au/portable/mp3-players/head-phones/sennheiser/stereo-in-ear-canal-headphones-sku-18214/

Thoughts? I'm more than open to suggestions if anyone knows of some good specials!

[Lazlow]

Get these (http://headphones.com.au/psingle?productID=413)

[Space_Monkey]

Get these (http://headphones.com.au/psingle?productID=413)

Those look great but do you think they'd have a noticeably better sound quality over the CX 300-IIs which are $40 cheaper?

[Lazlow]

Yes (http://headphones.com.au/psingle?productID=232)

[Silverwolf]

Sennheisers are fairly average from what i've seen/experienced. Or at least when dealing with their cheaper products theres always a better pair of headphones from another manufacturer.

I got a pair of the RE0s from a friend and they're great for IEMs, which I normally can't stand. So I second the suggestion.

[Space_Monkey]

I’ve been using Sennheisers for a while now and can’t complain.

The REOs are looking like the best option at the moment. I know purists would be horrified at the sound quality of buds but I’ve always found them more than acceptable. I can wear one bud in and listen to audiobooks at work!

[Italian Stallion]

The CX300s are terrible for the price Headphonic sell them. You can pick them up for around $30, which makes them OK value. The SoundMagic PL30s & Brainwavz M1 are both around the same price, and much better. In fact, I'd say they're both better than my CX500s even.

Unfortunately, that's the case with most Sennheisers.. there's nothing really wrong with them, they're just super overpriced.

[Silverwolf]

I’ve been using Sennheisers for a while now and can’t complain.

When you don't know any better that's what you think.

[Space_Monkey]

Get these (http://headphones.com.au/psingle?productID=413)

Thanks for the advice, I ordered these a few moments ago for $20 less than than last weeks advertised price. :)

[Vicious]

Got myself a new turntable:

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/_qQq7IsRuilM/TdIflwBb3xI/AAAAAAAAB5Q/0tq9aowZA_o/s640/P1030832.JPG

Onkyo Integra CP-1055F (direct-drive fully automatic). Cost $8 at a thrift shop since the lift wasn't working. Fixed it up and works quite well now ^_^

[Space_Monkey]

Get these (http://headphones.com.au/psingle?productID=413)

So as a bit of a follow up to this... I did buy these headphones, with express shipping (ETA two days) however almost two weeks later I am yet to receive anything.

I emailed the company Monday and got no reply, so I called Wednesday and got a pretty mundane 'we're looking into it with Australia post' reply, now on Friday nothing.

It's probably more the postie's fault but it's the poor customer service that's really bugged me, I won't be buying from here again and may just ask for my money back.

Prospective buyers beware. :(

[Slippery]

The CX300s are terrible for the price Headphonic sell them. You can pick them up for around $30, which makes them OK value.

Where? GF is set on buying some, may as well get them cheaper.

(Ftr I use them, and think they are fine, but I thought iPod earphones were 'fine' until I was shown otherwise)

[Space_Monkey]

Where? GF is set on buying some, may as well get them cheaper.

(Ftr I use them, and think they are fine, but I thought iPod earphones were 'fine' until I was shown otherwise)

I haven't seen them for less than $79...

[Silverwolf]

So as a bit of a follow up to this... I did buy these headphones, with express shipping (ETA two days) however almost two weeks later I am yet to receive anything.

I emailed the company Monday and got no reply, so I called Wednesday and got a pretty mundane 'we're looking into it with Australia post' reply, now on Friday nothing.

It's probably more the postie's fault but it's the poor customer service that's really bugged me, I won't be buying from here again and may just ask for my money back.

Prospective buyers beware. :(

My friend has bought from headphonic many times and had no problem, seems you just got some bad luck.

[Space_Monkey]

My friend has bought from headphonic many times and had no problem, seems you just got some bad luck.

It’s not an issue of luck. When you’re operating an online business you have to expect the occasional thing to get lost in the mail which is why good communication and customer service is so important. No reply a week after a complaint has been lodged is really not good enough.

[Lazlow]

Any recommendations for a single DIN head unit that takes SD cards but still plays CDs?

[Italian Stallion]

I can't recommend any specific models, but I've had 4 Pioneer headunits in total and they've all done the job well. Plus, since they're quite popular you can usually get them at a good price!

[Lazlow]

Did some quick googling and all I can find are double DIN units that do both, or single DIN with no CD player.

[Italian Stallion]

They're probably going to refresh the lineup in the next few weeks once the EOFY sales are done.. but Pioneer's website (http://www.pioneer.com.au/au/products/25/121/61/overview.html) lists at least 4 single DIN headunits with SD Card & CD support.

[Lazlow]

I obviously suck at googling, cheers.

[nintendo]

So. My uncle is looking at upgrading from his bookcase JBLs to some of the Cambridge Audio Minx series.

Any thoughts on those?

It would be a 7.1 setup, he'd be going for 3x20s for the front, 4x10s for the back with the X300 sub. Also would be looking at mounting them on the ceiling with the 360degree swivel brackets.

[Vicious]

So. My uncle is looking at upgrading from his bookcase JBLs to some of the Cambridge Audio Minx series.

Any thoughts on those?

It would be a 7.1 setup, he'd be going for 3x20s for the front, 4x10s for the back with the X300 sub. Also would be looking at mounting them on the ceiling with the 360degree swivel brackets.

If it's mostly HT I don't see any reason to particularly recommend against it in a medium sized room. A larger room will probably requiring turning them up to where distortion starts creeping in. It's also worth noting that many reviewers listed their treble performance quite clearly as a con - being a bit too bright for them. Since they're being mounted off of ear level this should roll the treble off some.

If he doesn't have to do ceiling mount though I'd recommend the NHT SuperZero bookshelves. They're efficient, easy to drive, and perform wonderfully both on and off-axis.

Unfortunately you'd have to order them factory direct and have them shipped international, but it might still be within the same ballpark. I'd buy a different sub to mate to them though.

NHT (http://www.nhthifi.com/)

[fishfishmonkeyhat]

Just got some Turtle Beach X41's.

That is all.

[Vicious]

Just got some Turtle Beach X41's.

That is all.

I'm sorry to hear that.

[fishfishmonkeyhat]

Knew one of you audio nerds would nerd it up, NERD.

Just using them now. I'm not sorry to hear all this.

[Italian Stallion]

Surround sound headsets are a bit of a gimmick. A proper set of headphones like Audio Technica AD700s would've given you better positioning & would probably sound 100x better.

But so long as you're happy, who cares!

[Vicious]

Surround sound headsets are a bit of a gimmick. A proper set of headphones like Audio Technica AD700s would've given you better positioning & would probably sound 100x better.

But so long as you're happy, who cares!

Well, they aren't true surround headphones. They use Dolby Headphone which I have the joy of using and surprisingly performs very well with certain headphones using a rather generic HRTF. The biggest problem I have is the quality of many headsets themselves, which is why I suggest stuff like a Mixamp and HD555 with a Zalman clip-on mic.

But I'm a picky SOB and like giving people crap. :D

[fishfishmonkeyhat]

Well the radio in GTA sounds great!

I can really hear the screaming pedestrians!

[Pai Mel]

I'm weird, but the way I like to upgrade speakers is one component at a time. eg. Most audio actually comes out of the center channel in a HT setup, so I would upgrade the center speaker first to something that sounds truly exceptional and loud enough for the room.


Then later when funds permit I would consider getting better mains. An ideal HT setup should have identical speakers except the sub. But I don't bother with this rule and neither do the companies - e.g. their center speaker in a complete HT package is horizontal versus vertical for the other channels.

If I did upgrade the main left and right speakers, the old pair gets used as surrounds.

The surround speakers only get upgraded if they are inadequate, or don't fit the room's aesthetics.

[Vicious]

I'm weird, but the way I like to upgrade speakers is one component at a time. eg. Most audio actually comes out of the center channel in a HT setup, so I would upgrade the center speaker first to something that sounds truly exceptional and loud enough for the room.


Then later when funds permit I would consider getting better mains. An ideal HT setup should have identical speakers except the sub. But I don't bother with this rule and neither do the companies - e.g. their center speaker in a complete HT package is horizontal versus vertical for the other channels.

If I did upgrade the main left and right speakers, the old pair gets used as surrounds.

The surround speakers only get upgraded if they are inadequate, or don't fit the room's aesthetics.

As long as they're part of the same series of speakers this usually isn't a problem. Mixing and matching can create issues such as odd THD characteristics, different levels of decay, odd ringing/overshoot . . . these make the timbre of the speakers so they tend to be obvious in differences with panning sounds.

[Pai Mel]

Even with all your speakers identical they are not going to sound identical in your room anyhow.

Speaker placement, furniture, shape of room, ceiling and wall reflections, curtains, carpet or lack thereof, sitting position, et al, all affect the sound even more so than having mismatched speakers.

[Vicious]

Even with all your speakers identical they are not going to sound identical in your room anyhow.

Speaker placement, furniture, shape of room, ceiling and wall reflections, curtains, carpet or lack thereof, sitting position, et al, all affect the sound even more so than having mismatched speakers.

But, you're combining problems. Different speakers + bad room = worse.

There's too many variables in a speakers to try mixing and matching. Frequency response against amplitude, dispersion characteristics, cabinet resonance, distortion, power handling, sensitivity, impedance mismatch, overshoot, ringing . . . it goes on for quite a while.

You're just begging to make your system sound worse by mixing and matching. When it comes to a pan in a movie, even with odd room acoustics like mine it sounds acceptable with similar speakers. Mixing them makes the pan sound uneven and wonky.