The cigarette smoking appreciation thread - the last vestige of coolness awaits!

[sausage]

I smoke cigarettes; have done since I was 13. It's great fun and you get to meet excellent people (the 10am-ers) outside buildings in all weathers.

And, quite apart from the nasty rumours going around of late, it's actually cool to smoke! Yes, that's right, it's cool. Look, a thousand black and white movies can't be wrong surely?

Bogey and Bacall... you can't tell me they're not cool? Amirite?

So let's all hail the humble cigarette and all those who smoke them. Let's not listen to this modern pinko wank about "cancer" and "2nd hand smoke"... you know what? So what!

Christ, live a little and light up a cigarette; you'll feel better.




Anyway, use this thread to tell exciting smoking related tales or wax lyrical about the screwed up lemon faces you see when you light up a cigarette around pinko leftist brainwashed sheep.


http://pullquote.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/have_not.jpg





http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_Wai0KpzGIPQ/SCW3uH5P6ZI/AAAAAAAAA30/4kBc-OE8Dt8/s400/bogey+lites+bacall.jpg


OHH YEAH GET SUMMA THAT INTAYA!

[HiredMan]

I've smoked since I was 13 too (32 now, shit, thats a long time).

I've had chest pains since December last year so have been trying to cut down/give up recently, hopefully before the emphysema sets in.

But yeah, it is cool. The other day I bought a novelty ciggie packet holder with a naked blonde holding a python of some kind, mainly so I could use that Otto quote from the Simpsons: "note the snake wrapped around the naked chick"

[Super Mario]

WWW.QUIT.ORG.AU

- SB editing out the pictures - these pictures of the hazards of smoking are quite graphic and anyone interested in seeing the side effects please click on the link.

[sausage]

Bugger the chest pains - that's awesome.


edit: @Super Mario - Giving yourself to zeitgeist is so 1960s.

[Super Mario]

http://pullquote.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/have_not.jpg





http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_Wai0KpzGIPQ/SCW3uH5P6ZI/AAAAAAAAA30/4kBc-OE8Dt8/s400/bogey+lites+bacall.jpg


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humphrey_Bogart#Death

Bogart, a heavy smoker and drinker, contracted cancer of the esophagus. He almost never spoke of his failing health and refused to see a doctor until January 1956. A diagnosis was made several weeks later and by then removal of his esophagus, two lymph nodes and a rib on March 1, 1956 was too late to halt the disease, even with chemotherapy.[124] He underwent corrective surgery in November 1956 after the cancer had spread.

[sausage]

Lies, all lies.

[fearofthesky]

I don't really smoke, but while having a few drink's I'll ask a mate for one. If they reluctant to give me one, I'll just tell them "but how am I gonna look cool like you?"

[Ad-Rock]

I spew if I smoke. It may be because I only ever smoke when I am already shit-faced from booze.

[sausage]

HAHAHA that's the spirit!

[Stevorooni]

I think that if someone blows smoke in my face as I walk past on the street I should legally be allowed to punch them in the face and force them to eat their cigarette.

Other than that I take the same attitude to smoking that I do to religion, do whatever you want but just keep it away from me.

[Tukenstein]

Right on, Stevo, my left-handed compatriot. I don't really mind if you smoke, but if I'm outside on a lunch break sitting on a bench reading I don't expect you to come over to my bench, light up a cigarette and start ashing it onto my pants while talking to your moron friend. Ash it onto their pants.

[FX-GTZ]

Smoking is a food and therefore will make you fat. It's just that the fat wont be noticable on your body, it will be choking your internal organs. Go ahead and smoke, your just gonna end up weighing 150kg and unattractive, but you'll be indenial about it all and continue smoking like its 1960 all over again even though you werent even born back then.

[Blue]

FX-GTZ

You make me want to stop smoking entirely.

[FX-GTZ]

lxPgdpIupz8

[Tukenstein]

So are you against smoking or for it? That last video makes smoking look damned awesome.

[Jickle]

The funny thing is that when I was a little kid, I always assumed that new people wouldn't be taking up smoking by the time I was an adult. But how wrong I was!

I do enjoy how film-noirs use smoking as an indicator for sex, though. Man lights woman's cigarette, cut to open window with breeze blowing in. Classy.

[Fenrir]

edited photo for content, click on Super Mario's link to see the effects of smoking
First of all, you're a huge wuss.

Secondly, my grandfather died of the gangrene one. It was probably worse than the image here. I don't use it as an excuse to be a self-righteous bigot.

I think that if someone blows smoke in my face as I walk past on the street I should legally be allowed to punch them in the face and force them to eat their cigarette.
This probably happens so rarely as to make mentioning it entirely irrelevant.

[sausage]

Speaking of classy, check out this smoking paraphernalia that was available back in the GOOD old days.

Man, these were the iPods of their generation.

http://pzrservices.typepad.com/.a/6a00d83451ccbc69e20115715bd685970b-400wi


http://pzrservices.typepad.com/vintageadvertising/images/2008/04/27/ronson_ad_1960_2.jpg


old school hard: http://www.apartmenttherapy.com/uimages/la/atla-080408-smokestuff02.jpg


EVEN PILOTS ARE COOL!!

http://pzrservices.typepad.com/.a/6a00d83451ccbc69e20105369193d1970c-400wi

[Vindik8or]

Cigarrettes are feminine, couldn't possibly be cool. Cigars are like chomping on some fat cock. The only way to do it is with a pipe.

[Stevorooni]

This probably happens so rarely as to make mentioning it entirely irrelevant.

Go for a stroll through the city at lunch time, it'll happen.

[Fenrir]

People maliciously attempt to blow smoke directly into your face?

[Stevorooni]

No, they just stand out in front of their buildings smoking and blow it outwards onto the street, a lot of the time I happen to be walking past at just that moment.

If they took some care and looked for people walking past it wouldn't be so bad but they sit there zoned out staring into space and don't give a shit.

People smoking on the street should be forced to wear air tight plastic bubbles around their heads!

[FrozenSoul80]

I hate very few things, but I have an intense hatred of smoking and smokers.

[Stevorooni]

You should ban all the smokers IMO

[Super Mario]

They'll all be dead soon enough!

[texta]

Smoking is a food and therefore will make you fat. It's just that the fat wont be noticable on your body, it will be choking your internal organs. Go ahead and smoke, your just gonna end up weighing 150kg and unattractive, but you'll be indenial about it all and continue smoking like its 1960 all over again even though you werent even born back then.
Wrong. Smoking reduces your weight.

[/backslash]

I think that if someone blows smoke in my face as I walk past on the street I should legally be allowed to punch them in the face and force them to eat their cigarette.

Other than that I take the same attitude to smoking that I do to religion, do whatever you want but just keep it away from me.
Same. Really hate parents/people who don't care about who they're smoking around. My brother's wife's family are all smokers and they all have kids - having a cig whilst holding a child in the other hand, that's some fine parenting skills right there.

I always have to hold my breath when walking past smokers on the street, absolutely cannot stand the smell & the overall stinkness of cigs on someone's clothes is a complete turnoff

[Space_Monkey]

Conducted a survey of University Students for a subject of mine recently, asked around 90 students what they considered cool and smoking got the most votes.... only slightly above Mac products.

[FX-GTZ]

Wrong. Smoking reduces your weight.
And wheres your proof? Are you living proof or something?

[texta]

And wheres your proof?
Here: French SA, Jeffrey RW. Weight concerns and smoking: a literature review. Ann Behav Med 1995; 17:234-244

Here: Klesges RC, Klesges LM, Meyers AW. Relationship of smoking status, energy balance, and body weight analysis of the second Health and Nutrition Examination Survey. J Consult Clin Psychol 1991;59:899-905

And here: Williamson DF, Madans J, Anda RF et al. Smoking cessation and severity of weight gain in a national cohort. N Engl J Med 1991;324:739-745

[FX-GTZ]

Well whatever then, being skinny isnt exactly good for you either.

[sausage]

lol have another beer.

[BB2K]

Well whatever then, being skinny isnt exactly good for you either.

He didn't say it was a good thing, he just said you were wrong.

[Super Mario]

Here: French SA, Jeffrey RW. Weight concerns and smoking: a literature review. Ann Behav Med 1995; 17:234-244

Here: Klesges RC, Klesges LM, Meyers AW. Relationship of smoking status, energy balance, and body weight analysis of the second Health and Nutrition Examination Survey. J Consult Clin Psychol 1991;59:899-905

And here: Williamson DF, Madans J, Anda RF et al. Smoking cessation and severity of weight gain in a national cohort. N Engl J Med 1991;324:739-745


I love you texta.

[FX-GTZ]

He didn't say it was a good thing, he just said you were wrong.
Dude i dont care if i was wrong, hell if you smoke and eat unhealthy s*** then you are technically fat whilst being a smoker.

[Blue]

Dude i dont care if i was wrong, hell if you smoke and eat unhealthy s*** then you are technically fat whilst being a smoker.No, technically somebody can't be 'fat'. They can be overweight. Smoking doesn't make you overweight, it makes you lose weight. Being 'skinny' isn't bad for you, smoking is.

****, I'm not even going to bother. Everything you say is wrong.

[Adios]

I'm an extremely "every now and again" smoker.

I enjoy it and it looks cool. I'm a sucker for a pretty girl smoking.

[borgster101]

No, they just stand out in front of their buildings smoking and blow it outwards onto the street, a lot of the time I happen to be walking past at just that moment.

If they took some care and looked for people walking past it wouldn't be so bad but they sit there zoned out staring into space and don't give a shit.

People smoking on the street should be forced to wear air tight plastic bubbles around their heads!

We need to follow Japan's model.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v366/borgster101/Japan/P1010500.jpg

Special areas for smoking

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v366/borgster101/Japan/n683307755_1568454_3722996.jpg

Helpful signs for disposals of butts

[FrozenSoul80]

I'm a sucker for a pretty girl smoking.

There is nothing worse than seeing a pretty girl light one up. Such a waste.

[fishfishmonkeyhat]

You sir, are worse than Hitler.

[Citizen Erased]

I have no interest in smoking, Ill just stick to alcohol.

[fearofthesky]

Dude i dont care if i was wrong, hell if you smoke and eat unhealthy s*** then you are technically fat whilst being a smoker.

And here I was wondering why people on here don't like FX-GTZ...Mate, do as I do, and think before you post. TBYP.

Anyway, its up to people what they do with themselves, and their bodies. The dangers of smoking are now so well documented, that no one (in the developed world, at least) could possibly not know the facts. We have gory photos on packs to remind us. The governments are constantly tightening laws (I'll bet that in 10 years, you will not be able to smoke in public, at all, which will be a bit too far but that is where we are headed) and jacking up excise.

If they were really worried about the health effects, they would withdraw sales of tobacco. But the'd never deny themselves such a lucrative income stream!

But I am a big believer in "you can't protect people from themselves". Banning smoking in clubs was a wise move, as that sort of environment is highly confined, causing non smokers to in effect be smoking themselves. But if smokers wanna harm themselves with their habit, so be it. I harm myself by imbibing large amounts of alcohol on the weekend. I harm myself by eating so much junk food. But these things only harm me.

So smoke on sillysausage! Please try not to blow it in my face, but otherwise go for it man!

[Lex]

smoke your lungs out bro! it's a nasty addiction and the high is laughable, not to mention it's hideously overpriced, but judging others for absorbing their chemical of choice is for ******s.

[Watchers]

Dude i dont care if i was wrong, hell if you smoke and eat unhealthy s*** then you are technically fat whilst being a smoker.

http://www.kombo.com/images/content/news/FrankGrimes.gif

[Xanafalgue]

Ahhh, I have been cigarette-free for almost a month. Cold turkey :cool:

[Clockw0rk]

There is nothing worse than seeing a pretty girl light one up. Such a waste.
I agree. So many girls look hot right up to the point where they pull out a cigarette, then it's all over.

[FrozenSoul80]

I'm actually surprised seeing the number of people I see take up smoking, seeing as smokers are fast becoming second-rate citizens :/

[Xanafalgue]

I'm actually surprised seeing the number of people I see take up smoking, seeing as smokers are fast becoming second-rate citizens :/

Which is unfair seen as they contribute more to the economy than most!

[Fenrir]

No, they just stand out in front of their buildings smoking and blow it outwards onto the street, a lot of the time I happen to be walking past at just that moment.
City air is loaded with automotive exhaust and **** knows what other nasty substances, yet you get pissed off by the briefest wisp of cigarette smoke?

Same. Really hate parents/people who don't care about who they're smoking around. My brother's wife's family are all smokers and they all have kids - having a cig whilst holding a child in the other hand, that's some fine parenting skills right there.
This I agree with, but the rest of this thread reminds me of the smug episode of South Park.

[sheeps]

Jesus you're all a bunch of 12 year old Christian queers aren't you?

[fishfishmonkeyhat]

Sir, that is unfair to Christian queers!

Which is unfair seen as they contribute more to the economy than most!

I wish I smoked so I got a break every 15 minutes! It's like that ep of Friends where there is a misunderstanding.

[FrozenSoul80]

It's like that ep of Friends where there is a misunderstanding.

Wasn't that the basic plot of every episode?

[sausage]

A non-scientific study consisting of one quick viewing and guesswork reveals that more than half the number of contributors to this thread are COOL.

Which is surprising since the last time I started a similar thread in the other forum that shall not be named it was locked after three pages of biffo.

Mind you, most of that can be attributed to me unfortunately, spouting "hypocrisy" this and "Nazi's" that to all and sundry who DARED declare the hate.

Anyhoo, keep it up; it's all fluffy bunnies and camel ears from here!

[Citizen Erased]

I know what this thread needs....

http://southdakotapolitics.blogs.com/south_dakota_politics/images/reinersouthpart.jpg

[McChimp]

I hate very few things, but I have an intense hatred of smoking and smokers.

This is me........and I smoke. I can't STAND being around other smokers, to the point where I'll almost flat-out snub people when I'm asked if I want one. I work in a drive-thru bottleshop and can't even count the number of times I've had to tell people (mostly walk-ins) to put their cig out, and get cussed-at for being a 'non-smoking (insert expletive)'. When I smoke I do it outside at home or right out of the way at work, right away from family/friends/customers. It amazes how many smokers still think they've got a right to smoke anywhere and everywhere they please.

........Oh, I'm trying to quit, too. ;)

[fishfishmonkeyhat]

Wasn't that the basic plot of every episode?

You're thinking of Three's Company.

[Blob]

There is nothing worse than seeing a pretty girl light one up. Such a waste.

I wish I could pep you Hard and fast.

My views on smoking vary from an intense hatred to meh whatever depending on the ocassion. I try to say that people can do what they want to their body but the problem with smokers is that their passtime affects others. Having a smokers cough for a few days after a night on the town even though I dont smoke is annoying, and dont get me started on how careless people can be with where they're blowing their smoke. Oh and that stupid smoke break system that people get. Why the hell dont I get a break every hour?

I just wish people could be more like Mcchimp and actually think about others.

[Blue]

Having a smokers cough for a few days after a night on the town even though I dont smoke is annoying …You have weak lungs.

Ever been on a camping trip? Had a campfire? Did that give you 'smokers' cough?

You can't get a cough from a night out, it's just not possible. With smoking restricted to outdoors, unless you're actually spending your night in the smokers area, there's no possibility of your lungs being exposed to anywhere near enough smoke to cause an ongoing cough.

[Blob]

You have weak lungs.

Ever been on a camping trip? Had a campfire? Did that give you 'smokers' cough?

You can't get a cough from a night out, it's just not possible. With smoking restricted to outdoors, unless you're actually spending your night in the smokers area, there's no possibility of your lungs being exposed to anywhere near enough smoke to cause an ongoing cough.

Yeah when im stuck with friends who all smoke for an entire night ill find that i do have a sore throat and a cough. And yes I dont like being around campfires either for that same reason. Guess I just haved weak lungs then.

[Vindik8or]

A non-scientific study consisting of one quick viewing and guesswork reveals that more than half the number of contributors to this thread are COOL.

Which is surprising since the last time I started a similar thread in the other forum that shall not be named it was locked after three pages of biffo.

Mind you, most of that can be attributed to me unfortunately, spouting "hypocrisy" this and "Nazi's" that to all and sundry who DARED declare the hate.

Anyhoo, keep it up; it's all fluffy bunnies and camel ears from here!

Nup. I've not seen anyone here who smokes a pipe.

[Space_Monkey]

What about the strain these smokers are putting on our health services!? Their foul lungs, gangrenous limbs, cancerous tongues and anal prolapses are clogging our hospitals! AND RAISING OUR HOSPITAL TAXES!

WON'T SOMEBODY THINK OF THE TAXES!

THE TAXES!

:p

[Vindik8or]

What about the number of people that smokers keep in jobs in the health and medical industries (NOT TO MENTION THE TOBACCO INDUSTRY!)?

[texta]

That's the problem. We have way too many free hospital beds so every time a smoker has a cough we put them in ICU for a week just so the nurses have something to do. If only there were actually sick people we could put in hospital or on surgery waiting lists.

[Ad-Rock]

I don't have a problem with smokers. I'd argue alcohol abuse costs our society far more than smoking ever will.

[Blue]

Yeah when im stuck with friends who all smoke for an entire night ill find that i do have a sore throat and a cough. And yes I dont like being around campfires either for that same reason. Guess I just haved weak lungs then.Yeah, or 'oversensitive' lungs. But anyway, your friends are the problem, not 'smokers'. All of the other people who are out at night smoking aren't doing a thing wrong, or doing anything that negatively affects you.

[kirok]

I smoke cigarettes and even in knowing it's doing me harm I continue to smoke cigarettes I've tried quitting many a time but I have also broken to temptation and continued my terrible cycle of damaging my body.

I really don't want to be in a hospital bed by the time I'm 50 I would much rather be spending time with my grandchildren or enjoying a early retirement. If I am lucky I might only have emphysema by 50 leaving the really bad downsides of smoking till my 60's or 70's.

It's a bad way to look at the later years of one's life but I choose to smoke and if I don't have the will power to quit I deserve the bad side effects that come with cigarette smoke much later in life or in some circumstances earlier rather than later.

I defiantly don't think smoking is cool and I surely would not go around telling people that it was. I've warned quite a few people not to take up the filthy habit but what I think is funny all the people I have ever warned about smoking have taken it I guess a lot of people just don't listen.

[Super Mario]

http://www.pulsepharmacy.com.au/images/products/807397m.jpg

[Blue]

http://www.pulsepharmacy.com.au/images/products/807397m.jpghttp://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l43/laundryamah/turkey.jpg

[Serenity]

Well whatever then, being skinny isnt exactly good for you either.
Not everybody can put on as much weight as they like, fool. You are so lucky there's no longer nep. Just the same as some people who are overweight have immense difficulty shedding kilos, try as they might.

Back to smoking: Repulsive plus I'm asthmatic. My mother is 48 and has smoked since she was 14. I've probably already got lung cancer from passive smoking. My grandfather ran a pub for 15 years and dropped dead at 70 from throat and lung cancer three years ago. Surely the passive smoking wouldn't have helped. But yeah, at least my dad's been off them for 10 years. Mum just can't shake it.

[[m]averick]

I dont mind people smoking, it's just how even being remotely near a smoker means your clothes end up smelling like stale smoke that really shits me. If they could stop that, then I'd be all for it.

[kirok]

averick;1105796']I dont mind people smoking, it's just how even being remotely near a smoker means your clothes end up smelling like stale smoke that really shits me. If they could stop that, then I'd be all for it.

The government has put a lot of bans on where people smoke mainly in front of food shops and all public eating area's if you haven't already noticed.
Generally most smokers tend to smoke in designated smoking area's at there work places even in most public area's there are also designated smoking area's.

[Space_Monkey]

Smoking in doors is a bit like sex indoors.

Mixed with alcohol, over and over again all night long it feels fantastic.

But when you wake up in the morning there’s nothing but the smell of stale cum and stained sheets. Then you realize it was the tobacco penetrating your body and not the other way around. :(

[Zan]

Consider me a smokers friend... there's something cool about being at a party, walking off and chatting with a stranger after asking for a smoke. Well, there's also the fact that I don't mind the smell of smoke... actually I think it just reminds me of pub's back before the ban and I get all nostalgic.

The only time I've ever loathed the smell of smoke was when my housemate smoked in his room and collected the stubs in a jar. The stink was horrendous.

Other than that, I have pretty much think along the same line as Bill Hicks. Righteous non-smokers annoy me more than smokers. The only reason I never gave it a shot was because:
a) It costs so much for so little gain.
b) Watching my housemate walk down two flights of stairs to go out in the freezing cold and light up looked kinda hopeless.

[Xanafalgue]

Consider me a smokers friend... there's something cool about being at a party, walking off and chatting with a stranger after asking for a smoke.

There is nothing worse than some smiley stranger sauntering up to me and asking me if I have a spare smoke, then trying to engage in conversation even though I've turned around and am quite clearly not interested.

Over a month now without a smoke :D I did have a craving on Saturday night though, passed a shop on the way home and inhaled a bag of Maltesers :o

[Mouldy]

Social smoking is the coolest. All the cool kids do it and so do I.

[Pauly]

I don't have a problem with smokers. I'd argue alcohol abuse costs our society far more than smoking ever will.
apart from the inconvenience of being around them (which is now fairly small), smoking doesn't cost our society a thing. we need people to keep dying prematurely, so that overpopulation doesn't become a problem. on top of that, these people are paying to kill themselves. it's win win for the government.

[Sytadel]

apart from the inconvenience of being around them (which is now fairly small), smoking doesn't cost our society a thing. we need people to keep dying prematurely, so that overpopulation doesn't become a problem. on top of that, these people are paying to kill themselves. it's win win for the government.

"Do your bit for Australia - kill someone's grandma"

Seriously though, people growing old and living long isn't a problem. The problem is that lots of people are growing old at once, and life expectancy is increasing but the number of years people work (or feel they are capable of working) isn't increasing.

[Space_Monkey]

apart from the inconvenience of being around them (which is now fairly small), smoking doesn't cost our society a thing. we need people to keep dying prematurely, so that overpopulation doesn't become a problem. on top of that, these people are paying to kill themselves. it's win win for the government.

Cept the hospital beds they take up with their weezing lungs, putrid throats and gangrenous toes.

The mounds upon mounds of filthy, carelessly discarded butts that wash up in our gutters and lakes.

The stress and grief that can be inflicted on the family and friends that are left behind.

Incidently I know everyones going to call me a pansy for this but when I smoke I love the fresh smooth taste of menthols. :D

[Pauly]

The stress and grief that can be inflicted on the family and friends that are left behind.
offer them cigarettes. more win.

[immol8]

Consider me a smokers friend... there's something cool about being at a party, walking off and chatting with a stranger after asking for a smoke. Well, there's also the fact that I don't mind the smell of smoke... actually I think it just reminds me of pub's back before the ban and I get all nostalgic.

The only time I've ever loathed the smell of smoke was when my housemate smoked in his room and collected the stubs in a jar. The stink was horrendous.

Other than that, I have pretty much think along the same line as Bill Hicks. Righteous non-smokers annoy me more than smokers. The only reason I never gave it a shot was because:
a) It costs so much for so little gain.
b) Watching my housemate walk down two flights of stairs to go out in the freezing cold and light up looked kinda hopeless.
I agree with everything here, except the "never smoked" bit.

I stopped recently because I got pains in my chest. Turns out it was something completely unrelated and mostly harmless, but it freaked me out enough to stop. And by stop I mean as a regular thing. Basically if I have a smoke it's because it was offered to me, and that's not at all often.

Currently enjoying not feeling awful most of the time. I'd like to have one, but I'd prefer not worrying about my health every day.

[Second]

I agree with everything here, except the "never smoked" bit.

I stopped recently because I got pains in my chest. Turns out it was something completely unrelated and mostly harmless, but it freaked me out enough to stop. And by stop I mean as a regular thing. Basically if I have a smoke it's because it was offered to me, and that's not at all often.

Currently enjoying not feeling awful most of the time. I'd like to have one, but I'd prefer not worrying about my health every day.

You should start joining Emma on her walks. Then you can start posting in the fitness threads!

[Spazzallo]

I only smoke when I'm shit faced. Never bought a packet for myself in my life and don't plan to. Waste of money and I know if I bought one, I'd buy another.

Morning breath after a night spent smoking is foul as well.

[castr8or]

Cept the hospital beds they take up with their weezing lungs, putrid throats and gangrenous toes.

Cept wrong

much of the burden on healthcare is a result of diseases in old age, a person who makes it to 70 or 80 is going to put a greater strain on our health system than someone with terminal cancer at 50

[sausage]

Cept maybe wronger.

I think you'll find that much of the burden on healthcare is a result of obesity-related illnesses such as high blood pressure, diabetes and heart problems, plus the inevitable weekend influx of alcohol-related emergencies.

And let's not forget sporting injuries and car deaths/injuries either.

[Fenrir]

Cept maybe wronger.

I think you'll find that much of the burden on healthcare is a result of obesity-related illnesses such as high blood pressure, diabetes and heart problems, plus the inevitable weekend influx of alcohol-related emergencies.
I think what cas is referring to, is research done a while ago which basically found that, if you don't off yourself on smokes, food, or whatever else, prior to old age, then you'll go on to use the same amount of healthcare resources (if not more) during old age. The focus was obesity, from memory, but it probably translates over to smoking.

[sheeps]

And let's not forget sporting injuries and car deaths/injuries either.

I'd imagine car related accidents are a pretty small percentage, especially deaths.

[texta]

apart from the inconvenience of being around them (which is now fairly small), smoking doesn't cost our society a thing. we need people to keep dying prematurely, so that overpopulation doesn't become a problem. on top of that, these people are paying to kill themselves. it's win win for the government.

Actually the last federal government estimate put the net cost of smoking at $8 billion dollars per year (that's $4bil in revenue minus $12bil in health costs).

And I think this argument about where the biggest health burden comes from is a bit of a red herring. We're always going to have old people but the difference is that smoking illnesses are completely preventable. You can't stop people getting old but you can stop them smoking.

[Fenrir]

Actually the last federal government estimate put the net cost of smoking at $8 billion dollars per year (that's $4bil in revenue minus $12bil in health costs).

And I think this argument about where the biggest health burden comes from is a bit of a red herring. We're always going to have old people but the difference is that smoking illnesses are completely preventable. You can't stop people getting old but you can stop them smoking.
Do I have to apply the reasoning of my last post here, explicitly, or could you just infer my response for me?

[texta]

I'd rebut that argument by saying that while you might use the same resources an old person would have contributed more to society.

And I'd reiterate my point that it isn't about comparing the cost, it's about comparing the ease at which those costs can be prevented.

[Fenrir]

I'd rebut that argument by saying that while you might use the same resources an old person would have contributed more to society.
Fair point, but the smoker is also chipping in via exorbitant cigarette taxation.

And I'd reiterate my point that it isn't about comparing the cost, it's about comparing the ease at which those costs can be prevented.
And I'd reiterate that if you prevent the cost of smoking, you incur more cost of old age.

[sausage]

I'd imagine car related accidents are a pretty small percentage, especially deaths.


Err, actually deaths are pretty inexpensive to the state in relation to car injuries.

[sausage]

Actually the last federal government estimate put the net cost of smoking at $8 billion dollars per year (that's $4bil in revenue minus $12bil in health costs).

Call bs on that 12 billion directly attributable to smoking. Don't bother us with government estimates because they don't mean shit.

..............but you can stop them smoking.


Bull-bloody-arse-shit you can.

[Space_Monkey]

Out of interest if you are a smoker do you have to pay more in Health Insurance? Will they deny you if you're a smoker above say 50? If you state as being a non-smoker on an application and then get lung cancer from smoking can they refuse to pay out?

[texta]

Fair point, but the smoker is also chipping in via exorbitant cigarette taxation.Yeah, but they're only chipping in a tiny fraction of the total cost that tobacco smoking has on society as a whole.

And I'd reiterate that if you prevent the cost of smoking, you incur more cost of old age.I'm not convinced that's true*, but even if it is the purpose of health care is to improve health rather than to minimise costs. That's the point I'm trying to make.



*I've seen the research you're talking about but also other contradictory evidence. I think it's an issue that is very much dependent on the way health care is managed in a particular state/country and doesn't take into account the benefits living longer imbues on society I've mentioned above.

[texta]

Call bs on that 12 billion directly attributable to smoking. Don't bother us with government estimates because they don't mean shit.There have been a number of studies putting the cost as somewhere between $12 billion and $20 billion. I quoted the most conservative one because I think that that cost is sufficient to understand the scale of the problem. The reality is in all probability much higher than that figure.

Also this:
http://www.aph.gov.au/library/pubs/cib/1997-98/98CIB16-1.GIF
(Source: Australian Parliament)

[castr8or]

I think you'll find that much of the burden on healthcare is a result of obesity-related illnesses such as high blood pressure, diabetes and heart problems, plus the inevitable weekend influx of alcohol-related emergencies.

And let's not forget sporting injuries and car deaths/injuries either.

no wrong again, apparently age related diseases will end up costing a greater sum than others by sheer virtue of living slightly longer and eating up greater resources in those last few years.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22995659/

I'd rebut that argument by saying that while you might use the same resources an old person would have contributed more to society.

by doing what? being old? most people contribute nothing to society, living those extra 5 years isn't going to change that for most people.



ANYWAYS I DIDN'T INTEND MY COMMENT AS ANYTHING MORE THAN A HUR HUR WHO'D HAVE THOUGHT COMMENT.

[Fenrir]

Out of interest if you are a smoker do you have to pay more in Health Insurance? Will they deny you if you're a smoker above say 50? If you state as being a non-smoker on an application and then get lung cancer from smoking can they refuse to pay out?
^This, but I guess how a private organization handles the numbers is its own problem.

Yeah, but they're only chipping in a tiny fraction of the total cost that tobacco smoking has on society as a whole.
Are we still talking about medical costs? If so,
There have been a number of studies putting the cost as somewhere between $12 billion and $20 billion. I quoted the most conservative one because I think that that cost is sufficient to understand the scale of the problem. The reality is in all probability much higher than that figure.
then I'll pick a mean cost of $16 billion, and point out that the $4 billion you quoted is a quarter of that. Does a quarter qualify as a tiny fraction to you?

Even if it's the full $20 billion, a fifth of the bill is a pretty hefty chunk to me, and I'd think would go some way to making up for the 10 or so years of lost tax revenue from them dying early; and if that still doesn't "cover" it, the government could use this to make a case for increasing cigarette taxation*.

I'm not convinced that's true*, but even if it is the purpose of health care is to improve health rather than to minimise costs. That's the point I'm trying to make.
Sure. But apply that point to obesity, and watch the fat rights uprising materialize before your very eyes.
I think everyone agrees that people can live longer, healthier and more fulfilling lives without cigarettes; but my point is regarding the rhetorical argument that smokers are a financial burden on our health system. The former is an individual's own private concern, whereas the latter is other people trying to establish a vested interest in the way smokers live their lives.

*I've seen the research you're talking about but also other contradictory evidence. I think it's an issue that is very much dependent on the way health care is managed in a particular state/country and doesn't take into account the benefits living longer imbues on society I've mentioned above.
It probably needs to be the subject of more focused studies, really. We're just throwing vague numbers around; the ratio of income tax revenue to health expense for smokers and non-smokers should be determined, and cigarette tax could then be adjusted to close the gap between the two ratios.


*Some smokers might whinge about this, but I'd call it fair.

[texta]

no wrong again, apparently age related diseases will end up costing a greater sum than others by sheer virtue of living slightly longer and eating up greater resources in those last few years.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22995659/
But again that study is focussed only on the Dutch health system and only looks at the purely physical medical cost that those extra years bring without regard to anything else.



by doing what? being old? most people contribute nothing to society, living those extra 5 years isn't going to change that for most people. Mostly by paying taxes. 5 extra years of life doesn't mean that the smoker and non smoker have the exact same level of health and then one suddenly dies aged 75 and the other one hangs on to 80.

What it means is that the smokers' health standards and their ability to contribute to society (through for example working and paying taxes) and to independently maintain themselves is going to be reduced well before they actually die.

[sausage]

It probably needs to be the subject of more focused studies, really. We're just throwing vague numbers around; the ratio of income tax revenue to health expense for smokers and non-smokers should be determined, and cigarette tax could then be adjusted to close the gap between the two ratios.


*Some smokers might whinge about this, but I'd call it fair.


I would live with this - excellent suggestion. But no more. No more.






Also...

HAY GUYS IT'S A APPRECIATION THREAD so....


Let's stop referring to health care as some sort of burden. It's a massive part of the economy providing thousands of skilled people many hundreds of millions of dollars into the domestic economy.

If smoking were made illegal then I forecast job losses, skilled workers leaving to work in NZ or other still-sane country blah blah.

So let's EMBRACE the cigarette; it's a economic green-shoot!

[Space_Monkey]

Well I asked if anyone else liked menthols and nobody freaking bothered to reply!

That said I find something relaxing and forefilling in rolling my own smokes.

If I have a fag I generally have to be drinking as well, my body not being used to the nicotine and I get light headed.

[sausage]

Menthols are still cool; it's official.

I roll my own too and take great pride in creating perfect cigarettes. In a post-apocalyptic world I'd be awesome.

[sheeps]

Menthols are gay as.

[Vindik8or]

Menthols are gay as.

Fags, if you will.

[sheeps]

Shit joke.

[Vindik8or]

Hey sheeps. You love it.

[Beinkasaurus Rex]

liability on ph system etc
that and mum smoked when i was in da womb~
bear in mind, im totally for people smoking with a pipe. preferably wearing a robe, and a monocle! =O

[Lazlow]

One thing I hate about the anti-smoking laws; can't smoke cigars while playing the tables. :(

[Fenrir]

liability on ph system etc
We ****ing covered this one to death previously in the thread, it is debunked.

[sausage]

Your 10 favourite Gaming Characters who light up for the cause (http://www.gamesradar.com/f/10-characters-who-know-smoking-is-cool/a-20090616102317115021)

[texta]

We ****ing covered this one to death previously in the thread, it is debunked.I agree that it has been covered but I disagree that it's been debunked.

[Fenrir]

I agree that it has been covered but I disagree that it's been debunked.
Debunked in the sense that, even if the average smoker is a greater net burden on the system than the average non-smoker, that is nothing more than an accounting problem on behalf of the system, which can be addressed by a tax hike on the product.
As I said before:
... apply that point to obesity, and watch the fat rights uprising materialize before your very eyes.
I think everyone agrees that people can live longer, healthier and more fulfilling lives without cigarettes; but my point is regarding the rhetorical argument that smokers are a financial burden on our health system. The former is an individual's own private concern, whereas the latter is other people trying to establish a vested interest in the way smokers live their lives.
Or in other words, people using the financial burden argument as leverage for their bigoted diatribes.

[Beinkasaurus Rex]

Debunked in the sense that, even if the average smoker is a greater net burden on the system than the average non-smoker, that is nothing more than an accounting problem on behalf of the system, which can be addressed by a tax hike on the product.
As I said before:

Or in other words, people using the financial burden argument as leverage for their bigoted diatribes.

edit; ill emit that <_<

just bear in mind, i think there should be heavier taxes on cigarrettes.

edit edit; where the **** did half my post go

edit edit edit; **** it this is why we cant have nice things

[texta]

Debunked in the sense that, even if the average smoker is a greater net burden on the system than the average non-smoker, that is nothing more than an accounting problem on behalf of the system, which can be addressed by a tax hike on the product.
As I said before:

Or in other words, people using the financial burden argument as leverage for their bigoted diatribes.

I think the "financial burden" argument is just a simplification of the real problem that smoking causes.

But for starters while you can argue that a future increase in tobacco taxes could offset the cost of smoking, I don't think you can argue that that is currently the case (ie that smoking already pays for itself) and until such time as tobacco costs do reflect the impact they have it's entirely acceptable for people to use the "financial burden" argument as part of a legitimate criticism of smokers impact on society.

And furthermore the reality is that if your evidence is to be believed, non-smokers may cost the health system more in gross terms, but the article also concludes that smokers cost more per year of life. So their fiscal burden on a government's budget over the course of any given financial year is always going to be greater. Because that's how Government's budget, I'd argue that looking at life time medical costs is irrelevant while per year of life costs is much more significant.

But the real problem with smoking isn't in putting the cost into financial terms, it's by looking at the real impact that the increased pressure has on our health system from a purely avoidable action. It's undeniable that smokers have more health problems and more complications from treatments, but not only is there the direct cost of that they occur from this, but our hospitals and health systems have limited resources and when some departments are inundated with sick smokers it reduces the capacity for the hospital to manage the health of non smoking patients. Not only in regards to people with the same type of illness, but it also skews the funding matrix so that areas such as heart disease and lung cancer get funding that could be otherwise distributed to other fields.

So in summary: when you smoke you're not just killing yourself and the people closest to you, but you're killing the sick kids in hospital too.

[aceaussie]

I've recently started to buy my own cigarettes, I'm 19 and used to be obese all of my life (Lost my weight prior to smoking) The reason i bought my first pack was because i felt bad always asking for a friends cigarettes.

I've been smoking for about 3 months but buying for a month and i must say i've started to enjoy them, i only have 3-6 a day it honestly depends on where i go, it still remains a social thing.

My views on smoking have also been altered since i do smoke :P

[sausage]

Keep it up man, you're doing really well.

[Xanafalgue]

I've recently started to buy my own cigarettes, I'm 19 and used to be obese all of my life (Lost my weight prior to smoking) The reason i bought my first pack was because i felt bad always asking for a friends cigarettes.

I've been smoking for about 3 months but buying for a month and i must say i've started to enjoy them, i only have 3-6 a day it honestly depends on where i go, it still remains a social thing.

My views on smoking have also been altered since i do smoke :P

Time for new friends.

[aceaussie]

Time for new friends.

Well I feel nothing could be better than a smoke after a hard nights work, well other than sex.

Also these friends are top people, I have friends that don't smoke and i don't smoke around them it just depends on the crowd i'm with.

[clarky]

I love the occasional cigarette at uni or when I'm drinking. Would never buy a packet though. I just 'borrow' other peoples. I know it's a dirty habit, but I don't really give a shit to be honest.

[sausage]

That's the spirit!

Moar like clarky plzkthxbai

[Lex]

why does SM get so pissy about others smoking? did your grandma die of emphysema or something?

[Zeph101]

To be honest, I've never quite liked it when people smoke, but at the same time I'm not about to preach to them about the dangers involved.
As a fat guy, I don't really have any moral ground anyway. Besides, drinking alcohol and being fat can be just as bad or even worse for your health IMO.

I will say though that I've been gradually loosing weight this past year, and I'm starting to feel the benefits. So I'd really recommend quiting, the improvement in health just makes you feel better. But then you wouldn't look cool anymore, hmm, such a conundrum. I mean, it's easy for us fat guys to want to look better, but then being fat never did look cool.

[Xanafalgue]

Fat people should just move to Mauritania where it is ALL THE RAGE.

I think this is my 6th or 7th week without having a smoke. I have a packet at home for EMERGENCIES which I was tempted to crack open today.

[sheeps]

Went to the doctor today about my cough, was hoping he'd blame it on smoking but he didn't even bring it up.

It's unrelated anyway, but was really hoping to have an excuse to quit. :P

[Xanafalgue]

Went to the doctor today about my cough, was hoping he'd blame it on smoking but he didn't even bring it up.

It's unrelated anyway, but was really hoping to have an excuse to quit. :P

Premature ageing!

[REQUIEM]

I dont smoke cigs, just the green every now and again. I love the act of smoking.

[sausage]

http://usera.ImageCave.com/sillysausage/cigarettepacket.jpg



FUN! (http://www.fodey.com/generators/cigarette_packet/generator.cig)

[9warbane]

http://i816.photobucket.com/albums/zz89/9warbane/cigarettepacket.jpg
Oh and they also kill you.

[sausage]

Oh I loled.

Well played.

[Blue]

http://r9.fodey.com/2074/08f6bec506134338861e23d6b198187d.0.jpg

[aceaussie]

http://r9.fodey.com/2074/08f6bec506134338861e23d6b198187d.0.jpg
Agreed :)

I need to cut down on my smoking, when i get depressed or stress i always light one up.

[Sir_Psycho]

I love that for years tobacco companies sold cigarettes as "stress relievers" (Let up... Light a Camel!) when nicotine withdrawals make you feel edgy. It's the cruelest irony of smoking, that they actually seem to trick you into thinking they alleviate the problem they cause.

But that aside, did some-one say pipe?
http://photos-f.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs267.snc1/9421_164564852322_784032322_3649677_6680956_n.jpg

[Zace]

What about the number of people that smokers keep in jobs in the health and medical industries (NOT TO MENTION THE TOBACCO INDUSTRY!)?

You would say that too Why don't you just go get chronic decriminalised hippie!

[Xanafalgue]

3+ months on - STILL SMOKE FREE.

You're all going to get cancer. AND DIE.

[Bokracroc]

A few months ago I got $75 from Imperial Tobacco :3

[Blue]

I smoke a deck every now and then when I'm out, and then don't even think of having a cigarette until the next drink I have. There have been times where I've gone through four decks of 16mgs in four days, and times where I've gone a month without picking up a deck. Half of the time that I drink, I smoke, and I drink quite often. This has been going on for a few years now. I think the addictive qualities of deathsticks are hugely overstated, but perhaps I just don't have an 'addictive personality'. Or, as I would call it, a FEEBLE MIND. :p

[Lex]

I think the addictive qualities of deathsticks are hugely overstated, but perhaps I just don't have an 'addictive personality'. Or, as I would call it, a FEEBLE MIND. :p

Physical addiction has very little to do with willpower. Now if you were talking about alcohol addiction...

[Sir_Psycho]

Noticed today that there's a new law dictating that cigarettes can only be sold from one particular counter. Interesting because this will not only inconvenience smokers, but other shoppers too when smokers run all there groceries through only to find out, "sorry, we can't charge you for tobacco on this counter, you'll have to take up two different counters instead of just one."

The inconvenience is only small, but I'm not sure what it's going to achieve. Will it stop minors from buying cigarettes? I don't see how. Will it push smokers to give up? I'm a bit lost.

[sheeps]

What? Cigarettes are behind the counter on a separate counter at Coles and Safeway anyway. Have been for years.

[Lazlow]

Yeah for about the last 10 years they've been at the service desk. :/

[Sir_Psycho]

There was a note taped to my local grocery store cash register saying that as a result of a new law it was compulsory.

I know it's been standard practice at a lot of places like the ones mentioned, but that was business choice, not government mandate.

[sausage]

Time for some visual



http://sevensenseintl.com/images/juicyjayad.jpg

MMMM Lick indeed.




http://mysticallv.com/smokeshop/images/hh-cuban-elegance.jpg

[drzaius]

I've smoked since I was 13 too (32 now, shit, thats a long time).

I've had chest pains since December last year so have been trying to cut down/give up recently, hopefully before the emphysema sets in.



dude - not good!

[texta]

There was a note taped to my local grocery store cash register saying that as a result of a new law it was compulsory.

I know it's been standard practice at a lot of places like the ones mentioned, but that was business choice, not government mandate.That law was passed last year and came into force on July 1, 2009.

[Dorkify]

Also, new legislation has been passed that bans displaying cigs completely. Will be put into effect within a few years.

[Bokracroc]

Also, new legislation has been passed that bans displaying cigs completely. Will be put into effect within a few years.
Linky?
I get shitloads of bullshit told to me at work but most of it is never true. (I work in a drive-through Smokemart BTW).

[Sir_Psycho]

That's going to make it difficult to play hotter, colder with checkout workers who either don't know their tobacco or don't know their english. "Yes, that's right, to the left. No, that's Winfield Gold, woah, don't take it out. No, port royal! Port royal! On the left there"